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Jul 18, 2019, 01:47 PM
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Author Topic: Asteroid Goddesses - the undistorted Natural/Divine Feminine  (Read 103095 times)
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Helena
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« Reply #285 on: Jun 09, 2019, 05:46 AM »

Hi Kristin and Nerissa,

Kristin, really loved this  Grin and that you took the time to answer and bring your Wisdom, thank you!

does reflect a changing of the guards and while all women will not dive into the freedom with a new pair of wings, it will energize more acknowledgement of the fire that burns within. It will give women more courage to not only ask for what they need but to honor what they need without apologizing for it.

So agree... Great image! I was thinking about it and there is a natural sense of maturity coming with accepting the answers one gets. Meaning the answers will always be correct from the soul's point of view, probably specially at this times with the Feminine issues coming so strongly, and women can show their personal sense of inner authority in accordance to their higher self not if they get or not get what they thought they wanted or needed, and whether or not personal truth fits within the structure of those needs. In sense that knowing what one needs comes also with the knowledge one can meet its own needs, sometimes can't and that doesn't diminished them in anyway, or literally fly to meet it and if it is in the spirit of the times. Personal truth seems very much the glue that is putting all together moving forward.

Also ended up getting the book you mentioned in a matter of minutes, even though my time for reading now is very limited gotta appreciate times when library keeps growing now with jupiter traveling my third house  Wink adding to Rad's previous recommendations earlier in the thread, hope i can catch up with the information slowly!


Nerissa, thank you so much for your kind words   Smiley
It's true right? and also amazing.
Now there is one thing you said it's also quite interesting for me, the fact we are on similar 'boats', right when i was drawn in the past couple of days, don't quite remember how and why, to the the asteroid Sedna.

There is a lot of information already in page 1/2 of this thread, and as you might know, Sedna's many approaches to the myth all agree that at some point she ended up in a boat with a her father that then cut off her fingers and let her drown in the Sea where she remained ever since.

I have not come to many conclusions by myself yet, but simply seems she is letting us know of the importance to now bringing her back. The times we face, survival, and the fact that she travels slowly and is for years on the last degrees of Taurus, one of Lilith's south nodes, the one that also brings up issues of survival for women's natural roots. She seems also to be a symbol of being lost, the Sea, the Spirit, on the consequences of the abuse of the "male patriarchal God", the father, that cut off her fingers, or her ability to do for herself.

I like to add to the myth the story of the Skeleton Woman from Clarissa Pinkola Éstes in Women Who Run With the Wolves, because it's like a follow up on the story, on bringing her back that is beautiful. Just like Rad mentions (pag. 2 of the thread) about the discovery chart making Sedna's chart very connected to Pluto's chart, and the fact that Éstes, shows Skeleton Woman as Life/Death/Life aspect of women and their capacity to regenerate, if only we All accept things live and die, against all delusions all should be pretty, avoiding dealing with the reality of the deep stuff. This what it looks like she brings. But i will dive in a bit more and if anyone has any insights to share on it that would be great! :-)


Abraço,
Helena

P.S. Just noticed current Jupiter in transit is conjunct Sedna's Pluto discovery chart!
« Last Edit: Jun 10, 2019, 04:03 AM by Helena » Logged
Nerissa
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« Reply #286 on: Jun 17, 2019, 02:53 PM »

Thank you again, Helena - more wonderful thoughts!

I don't have a lot to add - really just want to pipe in & say thanks & keep thread going...

The myth of Sedna has always resonated with me. I have also lived in those regions where her myth is organic. It's quite the story of betrayal - & yet the people depend on her for their livelihoods - they cannot catch the seals or other food if she doesn't help them: & yet she is cast away....entirely alone at the bottom of the sea...

To have cast away the divine feminine (not just 'women' or 'females') is to have cast away the root of wholeness and inclusiveness, the totality wherein there are no opposites anymore or divisiveness - instead of living in that wholeness they now have to 'consult' with her to access their natural birthright: as though it were outside of themselves versus within.....seems to sum up patriarchy to my mind!

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Helena
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« Reply #287 on: Jun 27, 2019, 02:13 AM »

Hi Nerissa, All,

completely agree with you Nerissa. From what i've been understanding she is all about recovering that wholeness within. The message from the myth ends up being one of self-respect, like she embodies the whole relationship Yod, truly mastering it from an undistorted perspective. As you say, unlike many other Goddesses she gives/nurtures/grants wishes only when people come to her and show respect, a highly develop Libra trait, very different from conditional giving, also very grounded in herself, deep in the Sea... Wow Libra, Taurus, Neptune!

I have been really curious and fascinated with Sedna relative to Lilith and, even though diving in astronomy makes me feel like a kid in a playground, also in a very good way :-), i found out some interesting things.

From what i've seen so far, Sedna for me has an underlying role on the re-emergence of the sacred feminine that is starting to show itself coming from the depths, and She really comes from the depths! A trans-Neptunian object, it's one of the most distant known so far in our solar system.
Astrologically Sedna is very much the embodiment of the water trine, an actual Sea/Trans-Neptunian Goddess, not only showing in the discovery chart, but well, she is in the depths of the sea, far far away and still nurturing body and soul of humans, whether we consciously know it or not. It seems Sedna has a special place in the collective unconscious.

One of the facts that most stands out to me when i started searching briefly is coming to know it takes her circa 12000 years to complete one cycle around the sun, and making the correlation that 12000 years is too half of one Yuga cycle, if i am correct. It is intriguing!
Searching further it seems the numbers from that cycle change, depending on the sources, range from 10000 to 12000 years, the most precise being 11487. Still, in any case, around 12000 years.
Then, seeing in the beginning of the thread Linda mentions this orbit "coincides with the rise of the patriarchy and the beginning of agriculture" seems to point in that way? Rad would this correlation be correct?

If we focus on her connection to Lilith and Lilith's nodes is even more interesting to find out that Sedna is thought to come closest to the Sun in the years 2075-76, a rather rare event.
Considering Lilith's south nodes range from 25 Taurus to 19 Cancer (and this last being conjunct Pluto's north node), we know she started making a conjunction to 25 Taurus in 2016.
At this time, 2016, the nodal axis was sn pisces/nn virgo, Neptune and chiron were both in Pisces and Saturn was in Sagittarius, conjunct Sedna's discovery natal Pluto, there was an earth trine between Sedna, Pluto and Jupiter, and also a Lilith/Pluto south node conjunction in Capricorn.
Further more, in 2075, Sedna will be conjunct the north node of the moon in cancer, Neptune will be also in cancer, all at some point conjunct pluto's north node and making a journey to the last sign of Lilith's south nodes. Saturn will be back in 2075 to same conjunction to Sedna's natal pluto in Sagittarius like in 2016. Lilith will travel from Leo to Scorpio that year, ending the year in Scorpio, trine to Senda and the north node.

I won't probably be here to find out what's going to happen, or maybe not in a human body, but would certainly love to! Although it is of concern to me, relative to what humanity is going to do, seeing Pluto, Uranus, Sedna and the moon's nodes will be making a t-square, in aries/capricorn/cancer, with pluto squaring the nodal axis and chiron also in aries making a square to neptune in cancer. Too much futurology maybe... But probably the next 50 years or so will be much significant to how we are bringing Her back, Sedna being symbolic of the unconscious beat for it to be heard, seen and felt, considering women's natural roots and the future of the Soul at the same time, nurtured with the wisdom of the past. We need boats and nets and a lot of fishing but i see mostly we need not to trow her away again back into the ocean like the mythological father, whenever she/it seems scary (Estés brilliantly shares this view point in the tale i previously mentioned).

Also, i like that in the myth her fingers and nails turn into sea mammals, fish, most mentioned are seals and whales, because of the spirit these animals carry in helping/teaching us access the unconscious and inherent creative nature. Seals for instance live mostly in the sea and only come to land to give birth and breed their babies, what a symbol connected to Sedna as a Divine Feminine Goddess! Some in the species also don't have ears, which help them do swim better and, in a more symbolical away, helps stay connected to the inner voice, inner self and creative gifts, away from unnecessary noise. Isn't a possibility that her message, coming closest in some years, that something is in gestation, something new coming to land, and we have the opportunity, now in these years, to chose what that will be, relative to the Sacred Feminine?
Personally i do know the power of the whale in a very strange/funny way... At some point in my life i lived in a place for a short period and decided, when i moved in, to finally hang in my bedroom wall a beautiful illustration of a humpback whale under the moon, that for some reason i had for some time and never look like it belong somewhere else (i even attempted to put it in another place before ending up falling in the floor, so i gave up Cheesy).
That specific time i ended up digging a lot of stuff that was hidden in the depths of my soul for sure, sometimes pretty scary things we avoid seeing or thought we had already dealt with, others accessing a creative magnetic place we all have and from where everything comes, sometimes starting as inspired dreams. And for some reason i can relate part of the enfolding of very significative events to the presence of the whale and her spirit near me, and how that was a symbol of the times i was so strongly living simultaneously, for better or worse. This only to illustrate the significance of these symbols/beings and how they can work in our lives whether we consciously want them to or not. They do.

Again just some thoughts, questions, ideas that can add to this mysterious times God/dess is bringing.

Helena
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Rad
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« Reply #288 on: Jun 28, 2019, 06:03 AM »

Hi Helena,

"Then, seeing in the beginning of the thread Linda mentions this orbit "coincides with the rise of the patriarchy and the beginning of agriculture" seems to point in that way? Rad would this correlation be correct?"

*************

Yes ........

God Bless, Rad
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Helena
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« Reply #289 on: Jul 04, 2019, 07:31 AM »

Hi Rad,

Thank you for your clarification, it is intriguing indeed... I have also been searching for more information on Sophia (asteroid 251) and got a bit unclear with information here in additional threads

http://schoolofevolutionaryastrology.com/forum/index.php/topic,472.0.html

http://schoolofevolutionaryastrology.com/forum/index.php/topic,462.0.html

From what i understand, Sophia is Divine Mother/Mother Earth originally linked to Christianity, and from a gnostic perspective Sophia is the "Embodied Wisdom of the Earth".
In the thread it is said that Sophia relates to the original 'sacred prostitution' and that Sophia and Vesta have each their own archetypes but share the aspect of sacred prostitution. Could you share a bit more on the meaning of the archetypes and how they connect?

Intuitively i do find Sophia, Vesta and Magdalene connected in some form of trinity but would like to understand the reason why i tend to feel it is so, but at the same time i do find it hard to understand the 'sacred prostitution' linked with an undistorted view of the archetypes for each. I take that Sophia and Vesta come through Madgalene, in a actual human body... But if that is so are we talking of the de-evolution of the archetypes from the sacred and original to the prostituion aspect, but they do in fact refer to natural women and the symbolism of Vesta?
If we are to refer to this symbols for an original perspective, in the natal chart, do we see them as possible having gone through one or both phases, distorted/undistorted, but most importantly now, do they show where souls, women and men, can find direct connection the wisdom of the earth within their own bodies?

Thank you,
Helena
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Nerissa
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« Reply #290 on: Jul 04, 2019, 09:31 AM »

Helena,
Thank you for asking these questions. It's funny how synchronistic this message board, EA are....& especially anything regarding the feminine asteroids

Lately I have been thinking of the symbolism of the 'Star' tarot card & how it relates to these divine feminine symbols....the card brings into play the ancient priestess, the cycle of Venus, really all of the deep symbolism of Venus & it seems these other archetypes either are that Venus symbolism or sorta 'satellites' of it.

I am interested in how Magadalene correlates to Sophia, Venus. Like you said seems the 'embodiment' of the archetypes, energy, truth of the divine feminine

All this is so synchronistic for me - the other year first discovered these points in my chart & just recently revisited as I'm thinking of all this & how it relates to the 'Star' card.

Magdalene & Sophia are conjunct my SN Venus
Their NN are conjunct my sun (& not far from venus)

Had forgotten all this until now! Just like when this thread started I was rereading the Lillith book & unbeknowest to me was having my Lillith return!

The topic of asteroids, sacred priestess, divine feminine are some of my favorite threads on the board. I'm looking forward to Rad's insights..

Thanks.....
if this is muddled thinking - sorry: still drinking morning coffee!!

editing to add: yes, I'm thinking of the trinity here as well. 333 is a number I see all the time! Understand it's correlated to Magdalene & that archetype, which makes sense as the trinity seems to be an interface between embodiment & the disembodied....again: need more coffee - best my brain can explain for now Wink

Another edit: interesting their north nodes tend to travel through Virgo mostly (dipping into Leo & Libra too) - I associate the priestess archetype with Virgo, and for that matter Mary Magdalene with Virgo, too & also consider Vesta a co-ruler....just interesting that this archetype is being developed via Magdalene & Sophia
« Last Edit: Jul 04, 2019, 03:32 PM by Nerissa » Logged
Rad
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« Reply #291 on: Jul 05, 2019, 05:45 AM »

Hi Helena,

"From what i understand, Sophia is Divine Mother/Mother Earth originally linked to Christianity, and from a gnostic perspective Sophia is the "Embodied Wisdom of the Earth". In the thread it is said that Sophia relates to the original 'sacred prostitution' and that Sophia and Vesta have each their own archetypes but share the aspect of sacred prostitution. Could you share a bit more on the meaning of the archetypes and how they connect?"

************

Christianity had not manifested yet when the idea/belief of the sacred prostitute first manifested. So the idea of Sophia being related to this is beyond me other than a 'projection' by humans that comes from the collective memories of that time into another time. There was no such thing as the sacred prostitute in Judaic times of old. In the original time of this the belief of the sacred prostitute was one wherein a women could absolve the 'sins' of men through sexual intercourse with women who were so designated as a sacred prostitute. This idea/ belief itself is traceable to Vesta in the sense of one of the natural roles of the total archetype of Lilith was one wherein certain women would initiate puberty age boys into sexuality: keepers of the flame. Those women were the archetype of Vesta within the totality of Lilith.

Coming down through time in many different cultures, patriarchal times, it was common for example for the fathers of puberty age boys to have them sexually initiated by prostitutes: "sacred" or not.

***********

"Intuitively i do find Sophia, Vesta and Magdalene connected in some form of trinity but would like to understand the reason why i tend to feel it is so, but at the same time i do find it hard to understand the 'sacred prostitution' linked with an undistorted view of the archetypes for each."

***********

The idea/belief of the 'sacred prostitute' itself is a distortion of natural laws. Remember this idea/belief was created by men, not women.

*************

""I take that Sophia and Vesta come through Madgalene, in a actual human body... But if that is so are we talking of the de-evolution of the archetypes from the sacred and original to the prostituion aspect, but they do in fact refer to natural women and the symbolism of Vesta?"

*************

The totality of the natural women in all of her natural manifestations correlates to Lilith. Remember too that the natural women relative to natural laws in not inherently monogamous. The natural women by choice would have sex with many men. In the end this was for survival of the species because of the need for genetic variation that allowed for a progressive strengthening of the immune system of the human species.

That natural law coming through time, distorted by men, manifested then as 'prostitution' where women were paid by the various men she would have sex with in some way. So from the natural to the distorted.

*************

"If we are to refer to this symbols for an original perspective, in the natal chart, do we see them as possible having gone through one or both phases, distorted/undistorted,"

**********

Yes  .....

*************

 but most importantly now, do they show where souls, women and men, can find direct connection the wisdom of the earth within their own bodies?

***************

The wisdom of the Earth, all of it's natural laws, can be aligned with by liberating from all the various 'beliefs' invented by men over great lengths of time and,  in so doing, redefine themselves naturally as natural men and women relative to the natural laws of each.

God Bless, Rad
« Last Edit: Jul 05, 2019, 07:38 AM by Rad » Logged
Helena
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« Reply #292 on: Jul 05, 2019, 08:01 AM »

Hi Rad and Nerissa,

Rad, i understand all you mention, so maybe my question was confusing in the first place, my apologies for that. Originally my question is related to the other thread here in this points,

"Sorry one more question popped into my head. Do you think the asteroid Sophia relates to the original sacred prostitution?

*************************************

Yes ..........."


"When I asked about the astrological symbols relating to sacred prostitution i was unclear about the vesta women. Are the Vesta and Sophia asteroids interchangeable with the two or is there another symbol that relates to the vesta women but not to sacred prostitute?

***************************

They are not interchangeable. Each has their own total archetypes but do share this aspect of the sacred prostitute. The Vesta archetype of itself does not necessarily mean that the aspect of the sacred prostitute that is contained within it have been lived out in all when considering it in all Souls/ birth charts. It is a possibility but not an absolute."


I see my confusion started with the expression 'original sacred prostituition' related to Sophia, Vesta and natural women, when the expression is in fact already a distortion in itself and i feel the need to in my mind at least differentiate natural vesta women and the invented 'sacred prostitute'. But if you don't mind me ask again, when original sacred prostitution is mentioned above, it means then original vesta women and not the distortion?

So my question is in what way the archetypes come combined and what is specific to each, in a natural expression, as i understand what has happened when the archetype of vesta became distorted but do not follow the connection to Sophia/Vesta in natural times. I take from your answer it simply evolved side by side with vesta and all distortions therein?
Would you agree in interconnectedness of Sophia/Vesta/ Magdalen (Lilith)? Magadlene's presence is certainly a root force and inspiration for all women, specially now with incredible presence and manifestation in collective consciousness (both the distorted and original too), but i still feel like i miss the total link to Sophia.


Nerissa,
also enjoyed so much reading your post! So true.. and well, the synchronicities.., this ' EA house' honours God/Dess for sure, so it seems all people coming to it with a desire to share end up always giving something of value for sure. I also have Madgdalen/Sophia conjunction in my chart and both also conjunct other planets,  nodes and asteroids, including in one side Lilith, the other also sn venus/ sn neptune. And then Sn magdalen conjunct my sun. So i was thinking if that is really a coincidence or something more general and ended up realising, from what i saw (if someone has other information please correct) that Nodes of Magdalen and Sophia, always conjunct. That is something to considerer in the link between the two. For example today,
Magdalene 25 Gem, SN 29 Pis, NN 28 Leo
Sophia 25 Libra, SN 24 Pis, NN 23 Leo

P.S. So nice you bring up the star card of the tarot! I don't know much about tarot but if i had to pick up a card to look at would certainly be the star :-)

All the best,
Helena
« Last Edit: Jul 05, 2019, 08:07 AM by Helena » Logged
Nerissa
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« Reply #293 on: Jul 05, 2019, 01:11 PM »

Helena,
I'm not surprised at all to see these archetypes so prominent in your chart!

& yes - you're correct: the NNs of Sophia & Magdalene are in cahoots - pretty amazing really Smiley

To me the Star card represents the pre-patriarchal archetype I associate with the divine feminine & the 'priestess' (for lack of a better word)....since this is an astrology board, I won't delve further into the symbolism! But - lots of great articles & really beautiful art work that depicts the card out there

Thank you Rad for your insights & clarifying some of these ideas for me

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Rad
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« Reply #294 on: Jul 06, 2019, 05:57 AM »

I see my confusion started with the expression 'original sacred prostituition' related to Sophia, Vesta and natural women, when the expression is in fact already a distortion in itself and i feel the need to in my mind at least differentiate natural vesta women and the invented 'sacred prostitute'. But if you don't mind me ask again, when original sacred prostitution is mentioned above, it means then original Vesta women and not the distortion?

***********

The original Vesta archetype correlates with the natural Lilith archetype, and expression of it, BEFORE the patriarchal times began. It when the patriarchal times began that things like the 'sacred prostitute' were created by men that reflects the distortions to the natural archetype of not only Vesta, but the whole of the archetype symbolized by Lilith.

***************

"So my question is in what way the archetypes come combined and what is specific to each, in a natural expression, as i understand what has happened when the archetype of Vesta became distorted but do not follow the connection to Sophia/Vesta in natural times. I take from your answer it simply evolved side by side with Vesta and all distortions therein?"

************

I already tried to answer this Helena by describing what the natural Vesta archetype was in the times before the patriarchy. It is from that natural role in those pre-patriarchal times that became distorted once the patriarchy was set in motion: i.e the 'sacred prostitute'. The archetype of Sophia is not linked with the archetype of Vesta other than being it's own archetype within the totality of the natural women as symbolized by Lilith.

The archetype of Sophia as I understand it is one of a natural teacher, a teacher of natural laws. Thus, the inherent wisdom because of the knowledge of those natural laws. When this becomes distorted it can then manifest on 'beliefs' as defined by various patriarchal religions versus the direct knowledge gained from all the natural laws that DO NOT REQUIRE BELIEFS AT ALL. Relative to the distorted Sophia this then can manifest as trying to convert others to whatever the nature of the beliefs are: the only way stuff.

**************

"Would you agree in interconnectedness of Sophia/Vesta/ Magdalen (Lilith)? Magadlene's presence is certainly a root force and inspiration for all women, specially now with incredible presence and manifestation in collective consciousness (both the distorted and original too), but i still feel like i miss the total link to Sophia."

************

There is of course a natural connection, inter-related, of these natural archetypes as rooted in the totality of all of those archetypes as symbolized by Lilith. To me Magalene is the archetype that  correlates and teaches about the natural union of the body and the Soul, and how natural sexuality as defined by the natural roles of both women and men is used, can be used, to actualize that natural alignment.

God Bless, Rad
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Helena
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« Reply #295 on: Jul 14, 2019, 05:17 AM »

Hi Rad,

still find i need to go through all you mention a bit more for my own understanding but really appreciate you answered even though my questions were not that clear.
This you wrote really helps and gives meaning to this questions,

"The archetype of Sophia as I understand it is one of a natural teacher, a teacher of natural laws. Thus, the inherent wisdom because of the knowledge of those natural laws."

"Magdalene is the archetype that  correlates and teaches about the natural union of the body and the Soul, and how natural sexuality as defined by the natural roles of both women and men is used, can be used, to actualize that natural alignment."

Thank you very much,
Helena
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