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Skipped Steps

Started by Rad, Sep 03, 2016, 08:43 AM

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Sree

Hi Rad ,Kristin

Thanks Rad for showing the right direction - i was thinking how that "Fame" in chole's chart got missed out.

I am writing the symbols , for "fame", here to see whether i understood it right .Along with pluto 5th her south node in 12 (fame) points to a past life of being an icon.But 12th house can also points to Naive( passivity etc) ,then what supports 12th house as "fame" rather than "naive" is because her South node of Saturn is in Cap 6th house along with Saturn in virgo 2nd - hard working ( workaholic etc) .Is these symbols that confirm "fame" rather than "naive "in her chart  or is there other symbols to distinguish fame from naive.

Also when she was in fame , that life time ,she didn't had a father who was critical but in the next life or so she had ( attracted ) a critical father to learn( as DDD writes)"in order to arrive at a realization of who she really is, someone who is defining themselves from the inside out as opposed from the outside in" .And during this life time ,with this father, she had  displaced emotions .So what ponder me here is that, with this displaced emotion, what role she would have played within the society.Does she  still may have acquired fame or not.Can we see such things from chart or am i just going out of track with Ea methodology.

Again thanks for the great opportunity to learn.I think asking questions is a great way to learn EA as it shed down all those perspective in my mind that is not in the right direction.

Thanks
Sree
   

Rad

#226
Hi Sree,

"I am writing the symbols , for "fame", here to see whether i understood it right .Along with pluto 5th her south node in 12 (fame) points to a past life of being an icon.But 12th house can also points to Naive( passivity etc) ,then what supports 12th house as "fame" rather than "naive" is because her South node of Saturn is in Cap 6th house along with Saturn in virgo 2nd - hard working ( workaholic etc) .Is these symbols that confirm "fame" rather than "naive "in her chart  or is there other symbols to distinguish fame from naive."

The 5th House Pluto inconjunct the Mars IN LEO correlates to the archetypes of fame for her that then manifests as a relative icon, 12th House S.Node relative to this Mars in the 12th that is inconjunct the 5th House Pluto, that manifests through the nature of her 'work' or career: S.Node of Saturn in the 6th ruled by her Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd which is then square that 5th House Pluto. With the ruler of the S.Node in the 7th conjunct the other Aquarius planets there, S.Node of Neptune, we can then also see the unique social positions or roles she has had relative to this fame, but also the inherited positions of social power and status that were mentioned before. None of this means that her Soul has not also being naive in various ways.

"Also when she was in fame , that life time ,she didn't had a father who was critical but in the next life or so she had ( attracted ) a critical father to learn( as DDD writes)"in order to arrive at a realization of who she really is, someone who is defining themselves from the inside out as opposed from the outside in" .And during this life time ,with this father, she had  displaced emotions .So what ponder me here is that, with this displaced emotion, what role she would have played within the society.Does she  still may have acquired fame or not.Can we see such things from chart or am i just going out of track with Ea methodology."

In order for her Soul to learn how to become self reliant, to become non-dependent, to develop her soul from the inside out, the change her inner relationship to herself, she had to create the lifetimes necessary to do this that manifested as these very powerful, self centered, father figures who would be dismissive, abusive, hyper critical, of all that she did. This could take place even in the context of those same lifetimes in which she had developed her own capacities, i.e. music, art, that created the relative fame. The emotional and psychological  impact of this criticism, abuse, etc, from the father, even in those lifetimes where the relative fame was taking place, was one of total devastation to her Soul: her inner relationship to herself. It would cause a deep inner sense of emptiness, the inner voice saying 'what is wrong with me, the accumulation of learned guilt because of this, the existential crisis of this manifesting progressively as what she needed to do the change herself: to adjust.

This is exactly where the skipped steps manifest from. In other words her soul has been desiring to learn to become secure within itself, to learn how to stand on her own two feet, to develop herself from the inside out, to learn how to give rather than receive, to learn how to objectify others reality so that she can know and give to them what they need versus what she thinks they need, and to give to herself what she needs without imposing or demanding of others to supply those needs. Her Soul does have natural guilt as well that she has desired to atone for: the N.Node of Cap in the 6th, ruled by that Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd which is the ruler of her S.Node of Saturn and Pluto as well. This atonement is rooted in the lifetimes in which she was utterly self centered and expected all to revolve around her: how she treated others, including her own children. This all starts with her family members: Mercury in the 4th conjunct her 3rd House Venus, siblings, squaring her Nodes in Cancer/Capricorn.

These skipped steps and ongoing evolutionary imperatives are mirrored in so many ways in her brother Shaw that we will be more fully discussing as we move forwards.


God Bless, Rad

Rad

Hi Tashi,

Welcome aboard.

God Bless, Rad

Upasika

Hi Rad,

Been back being busy since we did Shaw's, so like Skywalker ... if I get time I'll post something on Chloe but don't wait specifically cos I also might not get time either. Either way though I'm aiming to try and tune back in before too long.

thanks Upasika

theRiversolace

Rad or anyone,

I have two quick questions: one involving "˜skipped steps' and one involving the actual placement of Pluto in my natal chart.  I have been doing some reading on the stellium pattern in a natal chart-in my own natal chart, the S. Node of the Moon is @ approximately 1 degree Libra, Uranus is @ 2 degrees Libra and Jupiter is @ 3 degrees Libra-because of this triple conjunction, Pluto, which is @ approximately 24 degrees Virgo would be pulled closer to this astrological configuration, how much closer, I don't know. In your opinion, would Pluto be counted within the sign of Libra instead of Virgo and could a "˜skipped step' involve any hard aspect to the S. Node and the N. Node of the Moon?

Thanks, Marti

Helena

Hi Rad, Kristin and All the participants in the thread,

a special thank you to Kristin for the kind encouragement words, i've been travelling for the last few days so it has not been possible for me to have the time to read and follow all that has been discussed.
Once i settled down in the next days i look forward to study in to it.

All the best,
Helena

Rad

Hi Marti,

"In your opinion, would Pluto be counted within the sign of Libra instead of Virgo and could a "˜skipped step' involve any hard aspect to the S. Node and the N. Node of the Moon?"

No, Pluto is still in Virgo and, no, the only aspect that correlates to skipped steps is a square to the Lunar Nodes.

God Bless, Rad

theRiversolace

Rad,

   Ok-good!
   I have one more quick question: Would a sensitive point within a natal chart, like the "˜Part of Fortune' or any fixed stars squaring the Lunar Nodes be considered a "˜skipped step' of sorts or even the asteroids Ceres, Pallas and Juno?

Thanks, Marti

Tashi

Dear Rad
Here goes....

Quote from: Rad on Nov 30, 2016, 08:32 AM


The 5th House Pluto inconjunct the Mars IN LEO correlates to the archetypes of fame for her that then manifests as a relative icon, 12th House S.Node relative to this Mars in the 12th that is inconjunct the 5th House Pluto, that manifests through the nature of her 'work' or career: S.Node of Saturn in the 6th ruled by her Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd which is then square that 5th House Pluto. With the ruler of the S.Node in the 7th conjunct the other Aquarius planets there, S.Node of Neptune, we can then also see the unique social positions or roles she has had relative to this fame, but also the inherited positions of social power ...

Her Soul does have natural guilt as well that she has desired to atone for: the N.Node of Cap in the 6th, ruled by that Saturn in Virgo in the 2nd which is the ruler of her S.Node of Saturn and Pluto as well. This atonement is rooted in the lifetimes in which she was utterly self centered and expected all to revolve around her: how she treated others, including her own children. This all starts with her family members: Mercury in the 4th conjunct her 3rd House Venus, siblings, squaring her Nodes in Cancer/Capricorn.
>

Lets see if I am doing this right... the format and the material...

When I look at Chloe's chart I see a very ancient picture because I add Pallas Athena as a skipped step.. and that tells me that she may be atoning for not using her feminine wisdom, her logic, her strategy to overcome the problems that a patriarchal hierachy presented to her lifetime after lifetime. With Pallas Athena added to the skipped step she has a chance to use Pallas Athena to have the opportunity to value her logic, and while using her strategic analytic qualities, she will have to overcome her emotional patterns that stem from patriarchal hierarchical conditioning that began with her father(s), and her ancient rejection of her feminine wisdom. 

Pallas Athena is often referred to as Arachne -  a spider web"¦ and the Pallas Athena Amazon archetype is a feminine warrior who can fight for equality.  So,using her vast logic and wisdom Pallas Athena became the patron of Athens over Mars, because she offered them an olive tree, which would feed them.  She outsmarts Mars because she knows how to use the feminine in the patriarchal hierarchal society.  With the closing quinx between Pluto and Mars ( humility) is this why Chloe must be humble now as she finds her way out of patriarchal hierarchal societal traps and conditioning?

Could she have even betrayed herself (venus) her very own family and children (so node cancer) and her friends (Nep/chiron) and her tribe ( Ur/Juno), by not understanding ( mercury skipped step) the value (venus) of her own femininity (Venus) and inner real feminine wisdom (Pallas), instead she fell for the narcissism( 5h Pluto) and was attached to her position (Pl Cap), which gave her the privilege and feeling of being special you spoke of.

So now she has the opportunity to learn to navigate in the patriarchal hierarchal world as she learns to self empower(Juno) and awaken (Uranus) all these others (loaded 7h/8h and ruler of SONODE in 7h).  Also Moon can rule the public so she may have wholesale deceived/or was fake to the public with that MR between Uranus and Neptune in the 7h and 8h.  Or is that just a picture of the shallow level of society and entertainment that she moved through in the past lives you and others have described here?

And the Saturn closing square to the 5h, shows she is at a crisis in consciousness where she must face the wrongs she committed in her value system (Sat2h) and work (6) and imposed as you said earlier her will on others ( square to 5h).

[RAD  S.Node relative to this Mars in the 12th that is inconjunct the 5th House Pluto, that manifests through the nature of her 'work' or career }

This complex reminds me of something we all learned at the laguna EA school about the temple of Pallas Athena and those temple initiates who were bad/corrupt leaders who sacrificed others not to upset the existing egos in the male senators, etc... and allowed their sisters, daughters, initiates to die ( Mars/Pluto) at the hands of those who were disgraced by not being able to follow the initiations...Now she has Pluto in Cap = chance/need to learn to be a responsible leader and stop imposing her will (5h)on others... as you say below...

RAD  "her soul has been desiring to learn to become secure within itself, to learn how to stand on her own two feet, to develop herself from the inside out, to learn how to give rather than receive, to learn how to objectify others reality so that she can know and give to them what they need versus what she thinks they need, and to give to herself what she needs without imposing or demanding of others to supply those needs.  "

She may or may not be one of those temple initiates, but she bought some unreality wholesale, and she kept her position of being adored by betraying and continuing to behave delusionally, and her Moon in AQ ( ruler of her South Node) requires she course correct her delusional states and get more in touch with reality that of needing to be self sufficient so she can stabilize herself emotionally as you have also stated above... and then maybe serve a new tribe (Ura/Nep MR)?

If the TQUARE between Saturn at 29 virgo opposite URANUS JUNO and both Square to PLUTO 1 Cap talks about her authority being misused, this is part of her guilt (Saturn 29 Virgo).   Does she have a lot of guilt because people died because of her sacrificing them, or was she sacrificed?  She may have even been a willing sacrifice, the young perfect nubile female?)  Often we live out both ends of these spectrums.  Right?


In the tsquare Saturn is the faster moving planet is far past the opposition to Uranus and JUNO so she has many other lifetimes where she has been working to atone ( i am optimisitic by nature, and I think that is what you have been saying about her other lifetimes as a "diva")...

But with Saturn applying to the square to Pluto, she didn't yet really have the appropriate crisis in consciousness awakening.  She is having that this lifetime.  Uranus is Rx and is applying into the opening square to Pluto and is closer to the double novile 80 (83 DEGREES AHEAD OF PLUTO ) so she has a great deal of possibility to awaken(UR) to her soul's evolutionary necessity(PL).

So as she was delusionally based( Chiron conj Neptune) and her woundedness is to extract herself from the delusional stances that  (Pluto =5h narcissism, accepting the attention, false authority Pluto in Capricorn) caused her to be so misguided and both power driven( saturn squaring pluto), and fame seeking (5h).

HER PP is in AQ.  The Aquarius Leo polarity has to do with aligning our personal will with the will of God/Godess, source, all that is. 

Since the skipped step is in Libra she must repair her relationships.  Since Shaw's SStep is AQ he may have been part of this tribe or some other tribe where he was sacrificed. 

The MR between Uranus in Pisces and Neptune in Aq make me wonder if there were other religious sacrifices that she was a part of.  A quick look at his loaded 6h/12h suggest sacrifice, martyrdom etc.

Another signature for this scenario is Jupiter and Neptune and Chiron together could also be that she sold the bill of goods to others in the tribe (AQ)and they died for it (MarsSoNODE), or that she bought the religious nonsense wholesale and died for it? Or again, both. The traumas look old and complex.

I saw that Mel Gibson movie - Apocalypto - and realized at that time why so many people are atoning and overcoming the traumas of being sacrificed to the Gods for stupid religious stuff...

I wouldn't tell this story to Chloe or her family necessarily but I would wonder if these archetypes were at play here, and working themselves out through the Pluto cap (quinx Mars Leo,) and the Nodes in Cancer Cap would add to the patriarchal hierarchical world she must face now, and get it right this time?

So that's what I wonder about? 

Tashi
be the change you wish to see in the world
Tashi
www.enlighteningtimes.com

Rad

#234
Hi Tashi,

Thanks for taking the time, and making the effort, that you have to contribute to this thread on skipped steps. What we are doing in this thread is to make it as simple and essential as possible in order to understand what the core of skipped steps are in any given chart, and how to resolve those skipped steps.

Most of what you have written is pure projection and speculation that really has nothing to do with the core of the skipped steps in her chart: that core has been stated pretty clearly to this point by others. When we work with clients, or ourselves, using the prism of JWG's EA we want to make what we have to share as succinct, and applicable, as possible. Thus,  dealing with the essence of the archetypes without projecting past life stories into them. Doing that really is a disservice to not only the client, or oneself, but EA itself.

An example of this is Shaw, all that was written about him here among those that have been contributing, and then Kristin sharing her actual counseling session with him and his mother. One of his core skipped steps, for example, was re-orientating his soul consciousness to understanding other peoples reality and needs are co-equal to his own because of his own core self centering for the reasons that we talked about. Simple and succinct was how we approached it. And that is exactly how Kristin counseled him. And because it was simple and succinct the boy 'got it' right away, and it gave him a way of moving forwards.

So that is what we are trying to do in this thread, and it is the right way to do EA. And we also want to stick to the archetypes of EA. JWG wrote and taught about these of course, and when doing EA do not want to mix up stuff from other forms of astrology. For example, your saying the Moon correlates to 'the public'. It doesn't in EA. The public at large correlates to Capricorn, Saturn, and the 10th House. The Moon, among other archetypes, correlates with home.

So I will answer one of your questions in order to illustrate what I am saying about keeping it simple and succinct without projecting speculations into the archetypal symbols.

You asked: "With the closing quinx between Pluto and Mars ( humility) is this why Chloe must be humble now as she finds her way out of patriarchal hierarchal societal traps and conditioning?"

Her Soul has had a desire for fame, to be recognized as special, and icon, that has manifested in the ways we have discussed. That has included being born into powerful families that had high degrees of status and wealth: the ruling class. It has included competition with siblings who were in line to inherit such power and wealth. The humility that her Soul is in the process of learning, skipped steps, has manifested by being born into families that are "˜commoners' who have not social power or wealth, and, again, by learning, as her brother is, that others peoples realities and needs are as equal to her own. Thus, with her brother, for example, to understand and accept that he needs his space to be alone when he needs to be alone versus her constant need to put herself in his space. Just one example. In the ruling class that she has been born into those types of humans thought of themselves as superior to the "˜common people'. How the common person was treated by those in power and wealth of course creates crisis and pain in so many ways, its own kind of humility because of. The commoners typically are "˜sacrificed' by the rich and powerful for their own superior purposes. Thus, her soul, to recover skipped steps, has desired to be born into a common family in order to atone for the natural guilt that was born in those lifetimes.

This is an example of actual reality versus speculation Tashi. I do understand why you are saying what you are saying about the various symbols you have identified, and the reasoning you are using within what you are saying. This is why it is so important to know and understand the CONTEXT, the reality, of the clients life for it that very context and reality that then allows the EA astrologer to correctly understand and interpret the astrological symbols/ archetypes within their birth chart. In this way we minimize or hopefully eliminate any temptation or need to project meanings into those archetypes where in fact they don't exist.

God Bless, Rad

Kristin

#235
Hi All,

I wanted to share some follow up news re: Shaw, as I heard from his mother yesterday. She wanted to let me know that Shaw has shifted his energy significantly since the reading, that she is witnessing a sea change in his behavior.

This is an example of the power of bottom lines, spoken in simple messages that can really penetrate into the psyche and the Soul to induce changing behaviors.....and thus new choices.

Shaw came out of a therapy appointment this week with all smiles. He entered the car and the first thing said to his sister was,"Hi Chloe, I Love you."

On the heels of where things have been, his mom was positively floored.

I reminded her that life is an ebb and flow journey, that with his SN in the 4th, as well as his Saturn and Mars in Cancer, it could be a two steps forward, one step back process. Just like with the changes of the Moon, his moods may also change with the tides, but to encourage that he continue to feel all the way through his emotion versus reacting in the moment.

He now knows the WHY to his hard and heated emotions, and he knows he has a chance to move through them on his own, in a way that benefits all.

"SO the change is up to me?" He said.
"Yes", I said, "the change is up to you."

This puts the power back into the hands of a Soul who has felt like a victim to his circumstance. Step by step.

Peace,
Kristin

Tashi

Quote from: Rad on Dec 02, 2016, 08:58 AM
Hi Tashi,

Thanks for taking the time, and making the effort, that you have to contribute to this thread on skipped steps. What we are doing in this thread is to make it as simple and essential as possible in order to understand what the core of skipped steps are in any given chart, and how to resolve those skipped steps.

Dear Rad
Thank you so much for your clear statements.  I definitely did not read enough of the thread to understand what had been said, and I see now how I was speculating on archetypes.  I will be more careful, and pay more attention.  I have the utmost respect for the teachings of JWG, and am reforming all my notions of too much knowing of old astrological paradigms to advance my real understanding of natural law and totally appreciate all the points you have made here.  I continue to learn with great humility and respect for EA. 
Thank you so much for your candor.  I am grateful and look forward to the ability to continue to learn.
I appreciate the forum and am never afraid to stumble if I am learning. 
Grateful to your tender instruction
Tashi
be the change you wish to see in the world
Tashi
www.enlighteningtimes.com

Rad

Hi Tashi,

Let's continue on.

God Bless, Rad

Rad

All,

Unless any of you have more questions, or wish to add to what we have been doing in this current step we are in, we will continue on starting next Monday: December 5th.

God Bless, Rad

dollydaydream

Kristin, thanks for the update on Shaw.  DDD