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Author Topic: Seven soul types  (Read 7395 times)
Lucius
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« Reply #15 on: Jul 16, 2009, 07:14 PM »

The issue I'm interested in & want to know if I am understanding correctly - there is a difference between soul 'path' and the actual structure of the soul, for instance, Daemon as a structure and tantra as a yogic path (albeit suited to a Daemon), correct - ?  Bhakti isn't just a chosen path of yoga, but, also an actual 'structure' to the soul - and so on for all the chakras?  This is where the notion of 'correlate' comes into play - that doesn't mean a simple equation, but an archetypal equation - not a limitation on the soul.

Regardless of structure, then, a soul can have various paths in it's expression or issues - ?  We all experience all of the chakras & according to life experiences some are or may need to be experienced, developed....hope this makes sense - ?  For instance, a daemon with issues in relation to expression may have a throat chakra expression/issue, etc.

Also, for instance, there are, from what I understand actual soul structures that correlate with the other chakras (not just 'paths', i.e., techniques, etc.) I assume there are soul structures that correlate with, for instance, the 'bhakti' archetype and heart chakra - what type of soul structure is this & what would be the manifestations/correlates we could make in delineating a chart to understand what the structure of the soul is?  What I'm trying to say is that I know for many of us here it is profoundly liberating to discover the 'daemon' archetype & to understand ourselves....so, how can we do this for other soul structures?  How can we make the observation/correlation as we do with Daemon with the other soul structures - ?

Thanks!!
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Steve
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« Reply #16 on: Jul 16, 2009, 08:06 PM »

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How can we make the observation/correlation as we do with Daemon with the other soul structures - ?

Hi - I make no claim to be an expert on this, but to me what it is, is God constructed various Souls in different ways - what we are talking about is the inherent nature of a Soul itself.  The paths - Bhakti, Jnana, Daemon, Raja, etc.  are not "chosen" - their orientation resonates with the way the Soul is constructed, thus one is simply going to feel most at home in an orientation that closely resonates with that Soul's inherent nature.  Its like picking clothing or how one decorates one's living space - those choices express the way one sees self - they are not the self but an expression of it.

The "structure of the Soul" is its inherent nature -  all the rest is expression.  The Soul gravitates to that which feels natural, right, to itself, no logic is really involved.  You simply know how you are put together.  That explains your attractions and orientations - that is the correlation - it is self-evident.  An orientation to this or that chakra is again an expression of the nature of a Soul.

If one is a creative person, one can gravitate to writing, or poetry, or music, or painting, or photography, or sculpture, or pottery, and on and on.  Why one and not the other?  And yes, most creative people will be drawn to more than one expression, but will choose to develop one or a few much more than others - I am saying that as analogy. 

Really the point is not to know about a range of paths.  The point of yoga is to move towards Home - to yoke (yoga) one's self to God, through one or a few of the orientations - those that resonate. What the other paths are about, past a certain point, is just intellectual facts.  It is helpful to understand various orientations when counseling others, to be able to grasp how a person is wired and what paths they might find most natural.  But in terms of one's self, we are the way we are, because we were made that way.
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Lucius
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« Reply #17 on: Jul 16, 2009, 08:20 PM »

Thank you Steve.  So, a Daemon will orient toward tantra as a natural path to 'yoke' as you say ( and yogic tradition!) to source - ?  And a 'bhakti' to devotional, and 'anja' ,...etc.  Frankly, I do know how to 'tell' a Daemon soul but, not a bhakti, etc.  Just wondering how to help folks who have issues  when a soul structure archetype is explained they'll say,  'oh, that's why I feel that way!'.. and to see their lives & their charts and be able to help them understand issues - .as I know we Daemons here have benefited.  Thank you!
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ari moshe
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« Reply #18 on: Jul 16, 2009, 08:27 PM »

im also a bit confused- the foundation im missing here is WHY are the astrological archetypes listed by adina correlated with the chakra/yogic path that they are? It does not seem to be related to the typical physiological associations of astrology (ie heart= sun, whereas here venus= bhakti path/heart chakra).

So basically, were does this come from? Is there an empirical basis for it?
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adina
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« Reply #19 on: Jul 16, 2009, 08:29 PM »

Steve, I think you explained this very well, at least from the way that I understand it too.

I would add that I only included the Yogic types because many of us are familiar with them, but the essence exists whether we use a term of yoga or not. If we use just the other description, we have, for example, a nature-based soul (Daemon), or a devotional soul (Bhakti), or a soul whose essence is service (work) - as in service to others. It's thru the essence of that which it is (has been created) that the soul comes to realize God... i.e., the path. In other words, what you inwardly feel and relate to, as Steve explained, is both the essence and the path - you both feel it and do it.

Lucius, a Daemon soul will ALSO orient toward a path in which it "fuses with nature," as Wolf used to put it. It becomes one with nature itself, can communicate with nature.  Again, I think you'll be able to identify the soul structure of a client through your interaction with them, just like the evolutionary stage. Then you can take it from there. Sometimes - as many of us found out - it DOES take more than one reading, one appointment with someone to be sure of an evolutionary stage, and therefore the soul type as well. New Age lingo is so pervasive these days that it can sometimes take a little time to separate who's got the vocabulary and who has the inner orientation.
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adina
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« Reply #20 on: Jul 16, 2009, 08:57 PM »

Ari, the confusion may lie in the fact that in the birth chart, you're right, the Sun/Leo relate to the heart, but that's the heart as an organ, or as you said, physiological. And we're talking chakras (energy) here. The root of what we're talking about lies in Hinduism. The Chakra System itself has different correlations from the astrological ones. I myself learned these correlations from both Swami Kriyananda and Wolf, and again, they are rooted in the Hindu system of astrology. (Kriyananda, however, does not use the outer planets--Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto). Yogananda also speaks of these correlations in his book, "Autobiography of a Yogi," i.e., that these spinal centers correlate to the astrological signs.
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Steve
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« Reply #21 on: Jul 16, 2009, 09:49 PM »

The translation of  the word "yoga" from Sanskrit to English is "to yoke" - meaning a path that if followed yokes one's self to God.  The various paths exist and each has appeal to different types of Souls.  They all originate from Source.  They are all intended to pull us Home.  As taught in the Indian spiritual paths, hatha yoga is mainly practiced to train the body to be able to sit still for extended periods of meditation.  I believe it's not considered to be a path that leads to realization in and of itself.  Rather, preparation.

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So, a Daemon will orient toward tantra as a natural path to 'yoke' as you say ( and yogic tradition!) to source - ?  And a 'bhakti' to devotional, and 'anja' ,...etc.

yes, except I would rephrase "will orient" to "naturally tend to orient", because there are no hard and fast rules in life - each Soul is unique, and has its own past and thus long standing attractions.

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Frankly, I do know how to 'tell' a Daemon soul but, not a bhakti, etc.  Just wondering how to help folks who have issues  when a soul structure archetype is explained they'll say,  'oh, that's why I feel that way!'.. and to see their lives & their charts and be able to help them understand issues - .as I know we Daemons here have benefited.

That is a good example of the very point I was making before - we are here to concentrate on our own path, FIRST.  To know it well.   Think about it - perhaps part of the reason some Souls have taken on counseling others is because to do a good job of counseling requires one to expand beyond one's personal orientations, to come to understand the way that others are wired, even others whose natural wiring may be quite different than my own.  This expansion then helps me learn a broader, and less personal, orientation to things - thus my own evolution. 

That is some of the value I see in this present discussion.  We have Souls of various orientations gathered here - we can learn from each other through each expressing our natural orientations to things.  Like the blind men and the elephant, except the blind men have decided they want to see again, so they open their eyes.

Ari (and others) here is a chakra diagram I believe originated in an old book of Jeffrey's called Uranus: Freedom From The Known.  The EA chakra correlations, that I'd call spiritual correlations, came from Jeffrey's inner intuition and insight.

We can also include in this discussion thoughts about this diagram, and why things are stated there as they are.   There's not a right or wrong about it - seeing the value in this system doesn't negate other systems that may correlate differently.  These things are symbolic.  Astrology, and life, is observation and correlation - there can be symbolic systems that, looked at from the outside, appear to be in conflict, yet they still come up with similar conclusions.  As has been said before, any system rooted in natural law is going to conclude pretty similarly to the conclusions of any other system rooted in natural law. 

The importance to me is this diagram comes from the heart of what EA is about.  If we put ourselves into pondering Why it is as it is, it can deepen our insights into how EA looks at things, and why.

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Lucius
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« Reply #22 on: Jul 17, 2009, 07:33 AM »

Thank you for your time & clarification, Steve & Adina...greatly appreciated  Kiss
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ari moshe
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« Reply #23 on: Jul 17, 2009, 01:07 PM »

given that there is a natural correlation between physiology and the chakras, how can their astrological associations be different? physiology manifests from energy right? Another way of asking this question is- what is the practical use of this information- meaning does it apply to diagnosis in anyway?

sorry if im still missing the obvious!
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adina
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« Reply #24 on: Jul 17, 2009, 01:41 PM »

No need to be sorry at all, Ari. You're asking good questions. The physiological has to do (obviously) with the physical body and the traditional astrological correlations that you're referring to. The astrological associations to the chakras correlate to the energy body, or the astral body. The illustration that Steve posted shows the flow OF that energy thru the nadis, or passageways, thru which it travels. Again, all this is based in traditional Hindu teachings.  Smiley

And yes, there absolutely ARE medical (diagnostic) correlations for the chakra correlated planets/signs. All this information was included in the first segment of the EA DVD course, and also in his book, Uranus: Freedom of the Known, I believe, which is unfortunately out of print. When you combine the chakra system with the traditional medical associations, you have an exquisitely complete system to diagnose medical issues. For example, think of how much more information you would have regarding the heart if you used Venus, by house, sign and aspect, along WITH the Sun and it's house, sign, and aspect. There's so MUCH information that it's just not practical to try to include it here, but I hope his at least gives you some idea of the value of using the chakra correlations. Please do feel free to ask more questions about this.

If you're interested in learning more, Ari, there's also a transcript available of a workshop Wolf did called "Astrology and the Chakra System." Steve just posted a list of these here on the forum. I'm not sure what all is included, but it would be a nice inexpensive way for you to begin exploring this further.  Smiley
« Last Edit: Jul 17, 2009, 01:47 PM by adina » Logged
Steve
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« Reply #25 on: Jul 17, 2009, 01:51 PM »

Ari, the following is quoted from Wolf's 1994 Pluto School transcript.

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The reason to understand the chakra system, particularly with respect to medical diagnosis, is that it has a whole different astrological scheme of correlation, different from the traditional correlation of anatomy and physiology.  It is a supplement or complement to that traditional analysis.  It will reveal on a diagnostic level, information that you could not otherwise be able to determine in traditional methods of astro-medical diagnosis.  Let us start with the traditional correlations.

here he describes Sun through Pluto

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Now, when you combine the above with the chakra system, you will have a complete way of creating an absolutely correct diagnosis.  For example, if you have a client with all kinds of problems in their stomach, and you are looking in that chart, the nature of the Moon and the planetary ruler of the 4th etc., and there does not seem to be any particular problem.  But going to the chakra system you suddenly find the whole middle region of the body correlates with Mars and Pluto, and now if we re-look at that birth chart and see Mars and Pluto in opposition...!  So basically this is a support system to the other system.

My thoughts are, using medicine as an analogy, sometimes "alternative" medical techniques heal something that traditional medicine can't.  At other times western medicine works and alternative treatments don't.  They are two systems whose nature is somewhat at odds.  Yet we have empirical proof of what I said - they both work at times.  Similarly, we have two sets of astrological correlations.  Our brains may want to say that one must be right and the other not.  Yet they both work at times. Once again, proof that life is not pure logic.
« Last Edit: Jul 17, 2009, 01:55 PM by Steve » Logged

Lesley
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« Reply #26 on: Jul 18, 2009, 08:10 AM »

Hi to all,

I am still meditating on this, and I'm wondering if the limbs of yoga could also be understood/applied as follows. Karma yoga (path of action) can be correlated to the Solar Plexus, as this is the seat of action/will. Bhakti, of course, correlates with the Heart chakra. (To me, Bhakti could also correlate with the Sacral plexus; Venus, ruler of Heart, has its higher octave Neptune in the Sacral plexus' rulership, along with Jupiter -- and in Ayurveda, these are all Kapha planets: love). The throat chakra would correlate to Jnana: discrimination (Mercury), wisdom, as the throat chakra is also about intuition and 'higher' truths/messages.

My thinking-out-loud here is based on nothing more than my own insights and observations...maybe even those evolve over time, as the observer herself evolves? I'm sure that is so. The chakra system as a whole is such a beautiful manifestation of Natural Law...maybe I'll give the correlation thing a rest for a while and meditate on this miracle of energy running through each and every one of us instead. Inductive knowledge will come (can only come) in this way.  Smiley

Love and blessings to all,
Lesley
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Rad
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« Reply #27 on: Jul 18, 2009, 09:05 AM »

Hi,
 One thing to remember about the chakras is that they do correlate, anatomically speaking, to what are called the spinal plexuses. And these spinal plexuses have nerve that emanate from them to the various areas of the body that are linked to each one of these spinal plexus. In other words, the chakras are not just energy centers, they are indeed actual places in the physical body. This is why it is important to understand the astrological correlations to these spinal plexus and the corresponding physiology and anatomy that connects to them. As Adina said they combination of the traditional correlations with the chakra correlations can indeed produce an very detailed and accurate system leading to correct diagnosis of what is going on within the body.

 Rad
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Lesley
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« Reply #28 on: Jul 18, 2009, 10:04 AM »

Hi all,

On the topic of astrology and anatomy, I found the most interesting website: http://www.astrologyweekly.com/astrological-information/degree-anatomical-correlations.php

The information here links each of the 360 degrees with a different place on the body. It is so dead-on for myself, when I look up the degrees of my own natal planets, I thought I'd post the link here if anyone else wants to check it out. This list is truly amazing, at least in my own case...!

Love and blessings,
Lesley
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ari moshe
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« Reply #29 on: Jul 18, 2009, 11:42 AM »

this is great- so, here's a real life example.

the past few days the sun and mercury have been squaring my pluto venus. while anatomically my pluto venus has nothing to do with the heart, i have been feeling a lot in my heart chakra! (ie intense feelings of love, of sadness- all emanating from that center). if i get heart issues ever i can look at my sun and also look at my venus and learn a whole lot.

in the example you posted steve, while mars and pluto rules the middle region of the body, thus explaining the stomoch health issues, it MUST also mean that the diagnosis and the nature of the stomach issues is completley different than typical moon 4th house cancer stomach issues- bc it arises from a different aspect of consciousness.





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