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ari moshe
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« Reply #90 on: Apr 16, 2014, 02:20 PM »

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Hi Rita,

What kind of identity has this soul developed in the past that it is bringing right into this life SN?

The South node correlates to all the prior egocentric structure of the soul with its mode of operation for actualizing Pluto´s desires in the past, and where the soul is emotionally  secure and feels self identification in this lifetime.
Although we have the tendency to project forward the past into the present to remain secure, it takes an effort to go into the unknown to step out into actual insecurity as we are trying to break away from the past and its familiarity as an evolutionary process.

The identity of the soul with the South node in the first house in Leo, has brought forward is that the soul has a special destiny to fulfill, that involves some form of self creative actualization and nothing or anybody can get in its way.

Being in Leo this soul, could feel as a special destiny to be extremely creative but have no idea of what it came here to create as it is in the first house, starting a new cycle.
Another variant could be that this individual came into this life with a deep love and desire to have children (Leo) and live for their offspring, making them an extention of themselves.

This soul would have the ability to start new things totally independent from others. It would seek to find answers to its deepest questions by interiorizing its emotions and seeking the answers from within.
The need for freedom and independence would trigger a deep fear of a committed long lasting relationship, as the individual is primarily trying to discover itself as an individual.

Being in Leo through out its life it could have had hypnotic sexual attractions with no forethought (first house) of the consequences of these actions.Getting involved / or seeking relationships with somebody that was not really available for a lasting relationship so that the individual did not feel trapped into the relationship walking away at any time that things got too grounded.

All excellent and really well said. One correction: Leo in the 1st isn't inherently afraid of things getting too grounded. Grounding isn't relevant to this archetype. It's the need for freedom for the soul to actualize its own creative impulses however it needs to and the strong self orientation that may keep the soul from really integrating balanced relationships with others on equal terms. "Walking away" would perhaps be more relevant if Sagittarius was involved.

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Possibly this individual is needing quite a lot of praise and admiration(Leo) from others and constant attention to feel secure with itself. The first imprint of its fulfilled needs as a child if not fulfilled by the parents and immediate family would leave a deep imprint of neediness / insecurity as an adult in the individual.

 But also the opposite could be true of not needing the attention any more upon itself.
It could need to be recognized for its bravery and capacity to lead in what ever venture it decides to do, liking competition, it will push itself to their limits as it is so important to win and to be recognized as the star.

Well said

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Failure and shame would be a very difficult pain to bare. Limitations are perceived with anger that in extreme cases could trigger violence / intolerance in the individual,  This because they need to get on with it or go into a new project, impatience builds up  and weakness in the other is not tolerated, provoking confrontations of some kind with others.

Failure and shame as an archetype is not specific to Leo in the 1st. That is more Capricorn/10th house/Saturn.

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First house SN in Leo will like competition, and will work hard to be the best and once it has reached the best it will move on to some new thing again.There is a deep need to satisfy itself through being full of itself.  Creativity and role playing will expand its world view of who it wants to be.This individual could easily be a born actor or have  played different roles in his prior and actual life time so as to understand  and discover its self identity.
This individual could have deep unconscious memories of having been in a position of power in prior lives, and this attitude of superiority / being waited upon would be for this individual a natural way of being in life, shocking others who might not understand it and falsely interpreting it as something that is not, giving way to confrontations, that will make the individual go into itself and examine itself towards the others behavior or expectations that others may have of them.

The individuals can be very generous towards others, showering them with gifts that they have  personally chosen, the individual likes to be liked and to be the sunshine of others.
Possibly as a child and along its life this individual would take risks believing that it is super human and nothing could go wrong or gamble in bets with friends because of its need to exhibit itself as the best. Following its desire  for recognition or being noticed as special in some way, this individual could spontaneously engage in fights of honor over some sexual attraction with no tomorrow, finding itself in a situation with no way out, only  to understand the consequences of its desire once it is too late to stop the out come.
 
 SN in Leo first house there is a tendency for this individual to be full of self and focus its life on its self( first house / Leo), before others, these individuals have a tendency to be loners so as to be free to follow its desire at any time.
 
This individual in the consensus stage of evolution with south node Leo in the first house, would be focussing on having some form of  personal power or fame to feel secure of its role in society. Putting self first desiring to out shine all others,  using its narcissistic desires for fear of loosing its shine and glory to another. Having little awareness of the needs or desires of others, and always seeking the recognition of its presence by exhibiting its solar inner child in a dramatic fashion, basically all is focused through the self lens.

This expresses some possibilities of how this signature can manifest. This soul can also exhibit great generosity, leader for children, inspiring in their creativity or abilities, exciting and inspiring to be around. The soul's creative expression and ambition will be limited to the confines of what is already mandated and accepted by society. It may align with various mainstream sports, athletics, acting, music, competitive fields of any kind through which it can fully focus its desires towards creative self actualization.

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In the consensus state the individual could have the tendency to have co-dependent relationships, because it would be better to have somebody than to be alone and then suddenly finding the whole thing too oppressive but will remain in the relationship for fear of loosing its status, position. It is also important to remember that where the individual is born and what are the societies conditions will alter its desires and needs.There could be a great doses of narcissistic tendency with little instinct to give and help the other if it does not give it something back.

Co-dependency is not implied in this signature. Also status and position is Capricorn/10th house Saturn, not Leo or Aries.

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Individuated Soul would try to break away from any pattern of behavior that would restrict it to discover its creative self realization in a not so self focused way, although it may find a certain resistance ( cardinal / fixed energy) realizing that others also exist and are just as important as itself. Understanding  that others, that share similar ideas with some different points of views causing heated confrontations the individual realizes that their points of view are just as valid as its own, these confrontations show the individual how it is limited to its own narrow beliefs or outlook in life in general. This causes the individual to retreat into itself and  after some thought it could integrate and adopt as its own these new points of views. It would need to break away from any thing  that it felt was impeaching its souls discovery, be this society, family or job.

The individual is acknowledging that it is different to be in a group of one, and the alienation it feels towards the society, family and most in general is because it never wants to be integrated again into the consensus world..

The pull to discover out more of itself  is so intense that it will take it towards adventures so as try and find new ways of being in the world as the old no longer seems to resonate to what it now desires, and this desire is stronger than the familiar pattern that it was rooted in.
Once the soul has learnt to feel well with itself and has de-conditioned itself it now knows who it is and who it is not and what it cannot be.

The individual  will liberate itself from the emotional trauma by objectifying and thus becoming detached with the possibility of internalizing the event and working with it for what it really is and move on, understanding that  the trauma was an evolutionary necessity that its soul desired to experience so as to know itself better and in new ways and bring back into the society what it has to give of innovative without fearing to be absorbed in the consensus reality.

All this is possible. To clarify: as the soul progresses through the individuated stages it's center of gravity will progressively shift to its own inherent uniqueness and individuality. As that happens the soul will find ways of creatively self actualizing in whatever way is necessary for its own evolutionary needs: the need to become their own person.

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In a spiritual stage the soul would desire to know God / Goddess, the Source, through some form of service towards the other, feeling small as it starts to understand how small it really is in comparison to the universe. It could work relentlessly at training some form of physical exercise where it could integrate its life purpose.  Like Yoga, meditation or some martial art would by itself help this individuals have the discipline to continually focus its desire to rid itself of any separating desires  other that to return to the source.

The danger would be that it could feel that it has known God/Goddess and that it now has special powers over others, that these powers come from itself  creative realization(SN Leo first), when speaking to others spreading its message, it will speak as if the power that it thinks it has is from its own merit, giving it personal power and a sense of purpose. Sooner or later there are going to be confrontations with others who will point out its flaws and his soul will have to recognize by the humiliation  and downfall it will endure,  and that these separating desires have to be purged out so as to continue its evolutionary intent which is to work its return towards God/Goddess, the source.

This soul could also present itself as very shy and not desiring at all to be in the lime light, being happy as a second hand player, being alone with self would feel quite comfortable to go in its quest to unite itself to the source by letting go of its separating desires one by one. This could be because its soul has been deeply hurt and traumatized in the past, making it believe that it is safer to be alone.

All this is possible. The core of his sn is very much about expressing and acting in the world. So this soul, if it has a soul history within the spiritual stages, will have some sort of past where they were actively expressing, creating, leading and initiating their own projects for the sake of serving creation itself. Their own self actualization would serve a higher purpose. The narcissism and self focus can still very much be there. Right on with the shyness as a possibility as well though we'd have to see other signatures to back that up (such as the ruler of the sn in the 12th, Pisces or in aspect to Neptune).

What is the intended/potential identity development of the soul as a reflection of the souls desire to evolve?

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The polarity point  NN being in the 7th house Aquarius, this would show us that this individual is discovering his own identity in relationships through comparison and contrast away from the consensus societal ways.

"away from consensus societal ways" would only apply to souls in the individuated stages. It's more about learning about detachment in relationship, learning how to listen objectively and not react or do as they please according to their own self oriented filter.

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It will seek relationships who can broaden its view of itself in relation to its fear of loss of freedom. As these individuals seek new relationships when their evolution stagnates they will seek people who can help them understand who they are and how others relate to each other, it will not tolerate any person telling them how they have to be as it is leaving behind all the shackles from the past .


Yes, though it specifically IS learning tolerance. The soul will be learning how to listen objectively without always making it personal in some way. Opening to listen to the feedback of other people as well. The soul is learning how to share, to be with others and not take all the attention. To be an equal among many and encourage other people's own uniqueness.

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It would seek partners who need freedom and are independent thinkers helping it to understand that its fear to commit is just a fear and can be over come. Possibly this individual would like to live in some community for a while away from society.

Not necessarily. Living in community away from society is a very specific circumstance and is not implied in this north node by itself. Also, the 7th house isn't about commitment. The 8th house and Pluto is. So there will be resistance to evolution (Pluto) relative to wherever the soul is holding onto its needed freedom (1st house sn). For example Pluto may be in the 6th house and the soul may fear really devoting itself to offer its skills to the world. It might think that other people do it better and may feel jealous of other people's creativity. For evolution to occur, the soul would need to commit itself to a form of service that will allow it to share its creativity with the world. This would imply letting go of the self critisism (6th house Pluto) by way of learning how to be around other people in a detached way (7th house Aquarius: not making it about "me" all the time). This can also mean listening to other people's feedback and letting it be supportive instead of triggering immediate doubt and insecurity which then leads to stagnation and non movement.

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For evolution to proceed the individual will seek as many different people as it can so as to learn to objectify life situations and itself. This is very important as has been so self focussed in the past and now its evolutionary intent is learning to recognize the other person as an equal to itself. It is learning that there is no need to project its fears onto others, by learning to listen and accept the differences and uniqueness within others. It will also learn to share its creativity without out the fear of loss of position. It will welcome others who are just as creative as itself and acknowledge that others have a right to shine also It will also give to others what they need and not what they do not need or want.

Excellent. And again "position" is a Capricorn thing.

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Being in Aquarius it would show us that this person has suffered trauma through others and may now prefer to be alone then to be hurt again. What is the point, sort of attitude. This could show us that there was trauma  to the mental body becoming disconnected in another life, this situation has been brought forward from the past and it is still holding unto it, because its consciousness of time space reality is not there. This will only add to the difficulty this individual has with any conformity.


This is only a possibility if there are signatures that would imply unresolved karma with the north node, such as a planet squaring the north node.

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Freedom to be with as many people as it can will be a priority it may adopt the new cultural identities of the people it relates to, new foods, new ways of dressing, new readings that will broaden its views and help it know who it is. Friends, family will be surprised and can see the individual as a chameleon with little or no personality its own, but that would not be the case, as the individual is just trying on suits, to see which fits best its personality of the moment.
This individual would feel the need to be different, there could be a misguided rebellion as it is trying to find its authority within relationships, others and within its society, desiring its uniqueness  to be fully acknowledged by others.

Freedom to be with as many people as it can is not necessarily implied. Nor is new foods, new ways of dressing etc. And authority = Cap

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This individual could be extremely innovative,  this creates in the individual fear of the consensus  thinking for being  so different from others, it could have a very personal way of dressing, it would admire eccentricity and individualism  in friends, art, small groups and would probably seek different people to bond with or simply feel comfortable as a group of one. This individual could also be balancing his feminine and masculine side as it engages in different relationships.
 It is the need to complete itself through relationships learning about ones identity through comparison and contrast, the secret is to create a balance between the need to complete self through comparison and contrast the need to combine the polarity to create a balance  of the two  so as to create a new identity in which mutual respect, balance and equality is the norm.

The evolutionary intent for this individual is to find the balance, freedom and equality in the relationships it forms,  to integrate its SN in the present moment and the need to be free and independent to pursue its desire and its self creative potential and at the same time, by doing this it integrates the NNode evolutionary intent  for this life which is to decondition and rebel from any traditional or conform to any consensus values, by being its own individual unique self.

The intent to heal Karma relationships would be to stop having co-dependent relationships with others in which the person is not really itself and is no longer confused of who it is in relationship to others.

This is not necessarily relevant to this signature again unless there are specific implications in the chart that the soul is working on unresolved north node karma. What the soul may work through are narsisisstic orientations to relationship in which there is no real listening or intimacy but rather just feeding of the need to be seen and appreciated (1st house Leo) without really becoming known. This soul may also reach a point where they realize that no one really knows who they are - thus leading to more genuine and authentic sharing/listening with others as an equal.

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7th house correlates to all sort of imbalances and extreme behavior in relationships that could have flip-flopped in the past not knowing who it was any more as it adopted others points of views as its own, and possibly projected those needs outside of itself for validation to give it a sense of who it is, possibly creating all the distortions of the extremities.

Thank you for your post Rita! your explanation of the south node in Leo in the 1st was really well spoken and exemplifies a clear understanding of the various dimensions of how the sn can manifest. What you wrote about the north node implies some possible misunderstandings about the north node. Please feel free to ask any questions about anything of this.
With love,
Ari Moshe
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ari moshe
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« Reply #91 on: Apr 16, 2014, 03:02 PM »

Hi Mike,

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South Node in Virgo House 8
This soul has developed an identity with the pattern of being of practical service and working in the physical world,  of practicing humility, of  desiring to be worthy and seeking purification or self improvement, of  being self critical and worrying ( potentially feeling  guilt or potential of masochism ), of having discriminatory mental processes, of honing a form of craftsmanship, of organizing details and handling the "fine print" , and of being health conscious. With these Virgoan qualities placed in the eighth house, there is the sense that these are all  qualities which exist outside the self and that this soul must pursue or merge with these same qualities in order to evolve or transcend its current limitations. Feelings of  power and powerlessness will probably be attached to some of the aforementioned themes.  There is the potential for a psychological intensification of these patterns with the house placement. Looking at this South Node placement archetypally, the image of a soul improving itself through some sort of purgatorial process is an image that comes to me. Here are some specific potential expressions for this identity:

-A person who works very hard in order to heal or stave off a sense of guilt.
-A person who seeks power through some form of occult servitude.
-A person who seeks to be pure through celibacy.
-A person who is a sexual slave or servant.
-A person who seeks some form of salvation (underlying this is really a sense of power) through humility or service.
-A person who accepts a menial life of servitude due to not feeling worthy of more.
- A person who works out incessantly or obsesses over their diet in order to have control over the body.
-A person who becomes powerful due to perfecting a craft or skill.
-A person with an eating disorder.
-A person who greatly fears death and worries about death often.
-A person born into a low caste in a socially stratified society who cleans up after others.
- A person who worries about other peoples resources more than his/her own.
- A hospice volunteer.
- A person who feels guilty for other people's issues.
These are just a few specific examples to illustrate some of the multivalent possibilities for the South Node in Virgo in the eighth house placement.

This is excellent Mike! This expresses a clear and accurate understanding of the nature of the sn. I'm reminded of Patricia Walsh's book: Understanding Karmic Complexes as your words touch upon the multifaceted array of manifestations any identity can take on as symbolized by just one south node placement. I highly recommend that book to anyone studying EA.

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Consensus  A soul in this state would tend to accept consensus ideals around self improvement and would focus on socially accepted forms of work, service and health issues. Honing a craft or skill which is in some way useful to the society at large, acceptance of being a member of "the lower rung" in a class conscious society, etc.

Yes. However if this soul was third stage consensus it would likely imply a soul that was in the "higher rung" of society and might symbolize the psychology of superiority. Virgo can really go both ways: inferiority and superiority.

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Individuated    A soul in the individuated state would be more and more focused on self improvement or on honing a craft not in relation to any societal convention or need. Here perhaps a soul would be focused on self improvement through learning the craft of being an astrologer, practicing the physical art of yoga, sexual practices, etc.

Spiritual    Here the soul would begin to focus on true humility, spiritual service, and of purifying all separating desires (sexual and otherwise) from the self.

North Node in Pisces House 2  The intended/ potential development for this soul as a reflection of the desire to evolve is to learn spiritual (Pisces) self reliance (House2) which may involve such themes as letting go(Pisces) of the need to be  always practical(Virgo), of  reliance(House 2) on non physical resources(Pisces), of learning the value in dreaming/visioning and of giving things over to God/dess. Ultimately, the goal here is to be in touch with one's inherent value/worth as a child of God/dess and to extend universal compassion(Pisces) to one's own inherent self worth(house2)-a treasure chest of sensitivity and compassion  within. Giving all efforts over to the divine-perhaps heading to the mountaintop and away from the marketplace.

The North Node in this case helps to correct or heal the unresolved karma around the issue that a soul can potentially obtain power infinitely and evolve itself infinitely through desiring to improve itself or purify itself by attaching to ideals or power sources outside of itself. At some point the soul will have to "let go and let God/dess"-here is a  true spiritual treasure.

All that is true, and I feel you have the essence of it, though you seem to be bending mostly towards the spiritual stage in your description.

Nn in Pisces in the 2nd could also mean adopting to scarcity and poverty; learning how to live off of whatever is available instead of all that the soul has otherwise tried to control. Forgiveness, simplification and surrender is the core of it.
Thanks for your post Mike.
With love,
Ari Moshe
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rita
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« Reply #92 on: Apr 16, 2014, 11:14 PM »

Hi Ari,
 Thank you for your corrections and input.
Thank you for this wonderful opportunity.
Peace and love
rita
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Wei
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« Reply #93 on: Apr 17, 2014, 03:29 AM »

SN in 3rd house Libra

SN in 3rd house Libra soul has been collecting lots of information through various relationships in past lives. 3rd house is a yang mutable archetype, correlate to left brain, they are very intelligent soul with broadly knowledge, restless, need to observe/explain details/theory/facts in logical /rational/scientific way, not necessarily understand deep meaning behind facts. They need to collect as much information as they can to communicate/form relationship with others. In this way they feel safe and comfortable. They are natural talker who can hear/nurture what others really need/want to hear, they can be great writer/news journalist/debaters. They identify with linear/rational/empirical intellectual constructions, need to compare every aspect/everyone’s point of view about certain issue. Add libra archetype, they may form relationship with every kind of people, compare everyone’s intellectual construction, try to have their own stable way to interprete everything. The way they see themselves is shaped by information they absorbed, and feedback from others, everytime they are settled with one conclusion of who they are, they will absorb new contrary information, this could lead to split/various personality or feeling of "there is no ego, i am the information i collect". Their relationship is usually based on intelligence/knowledge they resonate with. It's possible they are attracted to intelligent partner, absorb all thoughts/point of view of the partner, collect information they feel (projection) the other need them to, so they can catch up in conversation, the partner could be seen as know everything (which 3rd/libra SN soul feel they need to know), thus create extreme dependency in relationship, SN 3rd libra soul needs to be nurtured by other's knowledge/advice, they store all kinds of information to please/gain favor of partner, they may talk about stuff without understanding the deep meaning, just quote. The other case could be opposite, they may be the smart one, nurture others with their knowledge/tips, make others dependent on them, they may try to rationalize emotion in relationship, they may know all kinds of theory and give others advices all the time, but not really identify with those tips, they may not listen to the real needs of others at all.

NN in 9th house Aries

Soul with 3rd house libra SN can be very defensive about their point of view, but they will relate to people with different thought, confront others who are used to right brain/intuitive thinking who has strong self-awareness and very convincing about their beliefs, SN 3rd libra soul will be questioned about their intellectual construction, social butterfly/smooth talker/superficial chit-chat just won’t work, they will be forced to dig deeper into meaning of those facts they have been collecting. By compare different point of view, they will realize “smart” is relevant, truth can be beyond science, they will have more open mind about this world we live in, learn to connect to their intuition, balance left/right brain energy, have a whole picture instead of collecting details. They will also realize that there is limitation when we observe things in human body, we can only collect so much information, the way to find truth is to turn inside. The soul need to learn to align with their own truth without other’s advice or approving, put energy into what's important for them, what nurtures/connects to them, cut off superficial relationship, and to break the pattern in relationship such as: which aspect of me do you prefer" "what do you want me to say" "how do you want me to react". When their relationship get extreme(they may lose their identity in too many relationships, they may get bored when no one can satisfy their needs to grow), they will have crisis/sudden separation/lost which force them to retreat from relationship, to be alone, allow them to explore new experiences, pursue their desire, be free/true to themselves, to find who they are, what they need, how to nurture their emotional body, then stop the endless facts collecting to please/impress others, just be who they are in a natural way. Also they will learn how to listen/communicate with others in a balanced relationship, learn when to/not to talk/give advice, have meaningful conversation. They can be great teacher who can touch the essence of what they teach, teach others how to be natural/balanced in relationship. They can also be truth fighter, pioneer figure, encourage other people to do the same.

Consensus state

In consensus state, SN 3rd libra soul will collect information reflect the trend of mainstream, they will watch news, follow what's popular, adopt authority or professional's view as their own, share with others. They need to grow with collecting more knowledge which helps them to be successful in society. They will develop communicative skill, maintain as many relationship as they can as resources if it’s defined as successful by their culture/society. They can be reporter/journalist serves the government(such as propaganda department), they may follow/spread fashion trends without their own style, follow popular topic/celebrities, don't think in their own, or very gossip people tweet/retweet all the time. They can be relationship counselor who quotes from expert/authority, give advices without listening to others.
When they exhausted by all the information/theory/facts which has nothing to do with themselves, get lost in all shallow relationship, they will forced to retreat to themselves, to calm their mind, realize everyone's reality is different, they need to learn what's relevant to their own truth. There is no need to be seen as smart/communicative by everyone, then only form meaningful balanced relationship. They may adopt some philosophy/belief system/religion reflects their ego structure, learn to be brave to spread their own opinion, teach others to be themselves, to think by their own, have a new self-image.

Individuated state

In this state, gemini/libra archetype manifest in a uranian way, they will form relationships with like-minded people. Their knowledge system reflects their evolutionary state and their desire to evolve, they will think in their own, beyond mainstream popular trends, they need to express themselves in a unique way. They are aware of other culture, fellow what's going on in the world, form relationship with people from other culture, travel/study in foreigner country. Through these new experiences they can develop their new self-image, improve their knowledge system, break free from limitation of their own culture/old thinking pattern, identify themselves more as a world citizen. In a higher state, they can be scientist who help society to evolve, change the way consensus people think. They can produce great TV program/news to tell the truth in a rebel way, built media empire, fight for the truth, create things such as Google/Facebook/ twitter, connect the world together, help others to band with like-minded soul, feel comfortable/safe to express their special identity.

Spiritual state

Spiritual state soul may identify themselves with all kinds of spiritual information, involve with too many different practice without develop one deeply, project GOD on so many spiritual mentor, learn from them, relate to them, so they can have GOD within/be GOD. By jumping from one spiritual/cosmology system to another, their mental structure just get more unstable. (I have a question, in spiritual state, do they still intend to explain the nature of Creation logically?) In other cases, they can be spiritual teacher who is defensive about their spiritual system, debate with people from other systems.
With NN in 9th aries, they need to realize there are many ways leads to truth, they should align with spiritual/cosmology system which is intuitively right for them, they can even integrate information they have learned, develop a new/unique system for themselves to know the truth. In this way they can be a real master, share his experiences, teach others/write spiritual/philosophy books reflects natural law, help others to find their way to truth.
 
Thanks for this thread, i really enjoy learning from everyone!
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fruitbat
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« Reply #94 on: Apr 17, 2014, 06:49 AM »

Dear Ari,
   Thanks so much for your response to my post. I really appreciate your wise additions and gentle
   corrections. I'll be looking for a reasonably priced copy of Patricia Walsh's book.
 Dear fellow students,
  I am enjoying reading your posts on the nodal axis.
                                                         Love,
                                                               Mike   
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ari moshe
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« Reply #95 on: Apr 18, 2014, 11:20 AM »

Hi Wei,

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SN in 3rd house Libra

SN in 3rd house Libra soul has been collecting lots of information through various relationships in past lives. 3rd house is a yang mutable archetype, correlate to left brain, they are very intelligent soul with broadly knowledge, restless, need to observe/explain details/theory/facts in logical /rational/scientific way, not necessarily understand deep meaning behind facts. They need to collect as much information as they can to communicate/form relationship with others. In this way they feel safe and comfortable. They are natural talker who can hear/nurture what others really need/want to hear, they can be great writer/news journalist/debaters. They identify with linear/rational/empirical intellectual constructions, need to compare every aspect/everyone’s point of view about certain issue. Add libra archetype, they may form relationship with every kind of people, compare everyone’s intellectual construction, try to have their own stable way to interprete everything. The way they see themselves is shaped by information they absorbed, and feedback from others, everytime they are settled with one conclusion of who they are, they will absorb new contrary information, this could lead to split/various personality or feeling of "there is no ego, i am the information i collect".

Their relationship is usually based on intelligence/knowledge they resonate with. It's possible they are attracted to intelligent partner, absorb all thoughts/point of view of the partner, collect information they feel (projection) the other need them to, so they can catch up in conversation, the partner could be seen as know everything (which 3rd/libra SN soul feel they need to know), thus create extreme dependency in relationship, SN 3rd libra soul needs to be nurtured by other's knowledge/advice, they store all kinds of information to please/gain favor of partner, they may talk about stuff without understanding the deep meaning, just quote. The other case could be opposite, they may be the smart one, nurture others with their knowledge/tips, make others dependent on them, they may try to rationalize emotion in relationship, they may know all kinds of theory and give others advices all the time, but not really identify with those tips, they may not listen to the real needs of others at all.

All well said. Another aspect to it would be their ability to use words and communicate in a helpful way. Libra being the psychology of listening where the 3rd house is actual hearing. They may be very skilled at using words and speaking to various people in ways that they can hear. This is the signature of a soul who may be truly gifted at writing, offering helpful feedback etc.

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NN in 9th house Aries

Soul with 3rd house libra SN can be very defensive about their point of view, but they will relate to people with different thought, confront others who are used to right brain/intuitive thinking who has strong self-awareness and very convincing about their beliefs, SN 3rd libra soul will be questioned about their intellectual construction, social butterfly/smooth talker/superficial chit-chat just won’t work, they will be forced to dig deeper into meaning of those facts they have been collecting. By compare different point of view, they will realize “smart” is relevant, truth can be beyond science, they will have more open mind about this world we live in, learn to connect to their intuition, balance left/right brain energy, have a whole picture instead of collecting details.

They will also realize that there is limitation when we observe things in human body, we can only collect so much information, the way to find truth is to turn inside. The soul need to learn to align with their own truth without other’s advice or approving, put energy into what's important for them, what nurtures/connects to them, cut off superficial relationship, and to break the pattern in relationship such as: which aspect of me do you prefer" "what do you want me to say" "how do you want me to react".

When their relationship get extreme(they may lose their identity in too many relationships, they may get bored when no one can satisfy their needs to grow), they will have crisis/sudden separation/lost which force them to retreat from relationship, to be alone, allow them to explore new experiences, pursue their desire, be free/true to themselves, to find who they are, what they need, how to nurture their emotional body, then stop the endless facts collecting to please/impress others, just be who they are in a natural way. Also they will learn how to listen/communicate with others in a balanced relationship, learn when to/not to talk/give advice, have meaningful conversation. They can be great teacher who can touch the essence of what they teach, teach others how to be natural/balanced in relationship. They can also be truth fighter, pioneer figure, encourage other people to do the same.

Consensus state

In consensus state, SN 3rd libra soul will collect information reflect the trend of mainstream, they will watch news, follow what's popular, adopt authority or professional's view as their own, share with others. They need to grow with collecting more knowledge which helps them to be successful in society. They will develop communicative skill, maintain as many relationship as they can as resources if it’s defined as successful by their culture/society. They can be reporter/journalist serves the government(such as propaganda department), they may follow/spread fashion trends without their own style, follow popular topic/celebrities, don't think in their own, or very gossip people tweet/retweet all the time. They can be relationship counselor who quotes from expert/authority, give advices without listening to others.
When they exhausted by all the information/theory/facts which has nothing to do with themselves, get lost in all shallow relationship, they will forced to retreat to themselves, to calm their mind, realize everyone's reality is different, they need to learn what's relevant to their own truth. There is no need to be seen as smart/communicative by everyone, then only form meaningful balanced relationship. They may adopt some philosophy/belief system/religion reflects their ego structure, learn to be brave to spread their own opinion, teach others to be themselves, to think by their own, have a new self-image.

Individuated state

In this state, gemini/libra archetype manifest in a uranian way, they will form relationships with like-minded people. Their knowledge system reflects their evolutionary state and their desire to evolve, they will think in their own, beyond mainstream popular trends, they need to express themselves in a unique way. They are aware of other culture, fellow what's going on in the world, form relationship with people from other culture, travel/study in foreigner country. Through these new experiences they can develop their new self-image, improve their knowledge system, break free from limitation of their own culture/old thinking pattern, identify themselves more as a world citizen. In a higher state, they can be scientist who help society to evolve, change the way consensus people think. They can produce great TV program/news to tell the truth in a rebel way, built media empire, fight for the truth, create things such as Google/Facebook/ twitter, connect the world together, help others to band with like-minded soul, feel comfortable/safe to express their special identity.

Spiritual state

Spiritual state soul may identify themselves with all kinds of spiritual information, involve with too many different practice without develop one deeply, project GOD on so many spiritual mentor, learn from them, relate to them, so they can have GOD within/be GOD. By jumping from one spiritual/cosmology system to another, their mental structure just get more unstable. (I have a question, in spiritual state, do they still intend to explain the nature of Creation logically?)


Jumping from one spiritual cosmology to another would be more like Gemini in the 9th.
Using logical constructs as a primary way to understand creation is relevant to the individuated stages: the intelligence being the bottom line.

Remember, we are describing the nature of the self image, so this is the filter through which the soul will emotionally relate to and integrate its human experience. In the spiritual state, no matter where the south node is, the soul will be seeking direct experience of God beyond just the mind.

Regarding things like how the soul might explain the nature of creation, it depends on the dynamics of the chart. For example I have a lot of Sag/Gemini synthesized in my chart, so in part its relevant for me to be logical when explaining the truth. The key however is that I don't try to use logic to reach the truth. That again would be more individuated stage.

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In other cases, they can be spiritual teacher who is defensive labout their spiritual system, debate with people from other systems.

With NN in 9th aries, they need to realize there are many ways leads to truth, they should align with spiritual/cosmology system which is intuitively right for them, they can even integrate information they have learned, develop a new/unique system for themselves to know the truth. In this way they can be a real master, share his experiences, teach others/write spiritual/philosophy books reflects natural law, help others to find their way to truth.
 
Thanks for this thread, i really enjoy learning from everyone!

Thank you for your post Wei! Everything you wrote expresses an accurate and clear understanding of the nature of the nodal axis.
With love,
Ari Moshe
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Wei
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« Reply #96 on: Apr 18, 2014, 07:55 PM »

Hi Ari, thanks for clarifying the difference between how souls seek the truth/explain the truth in spiritual state, i was confused about it.
Love
Wei
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Katherine
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« Reply #97 on: Apr 19, 2014, 05:34 AM »


SN in Aries/ the 1st

The Soul has begun a new cycle of evolutionary growth by desiring an ego structure that will accelerate evolution on a conscious and subjective level.  The subjective awareness, the “I”, is the identity—it is completely self-referential and unqualified.  On instinct, the personality will (by whatever means necessary) initiate experiences that assert their independence and sovereignty.  These expressions of willpower are the manifestations of the core desire nature: to be free.  To be free from any existing limitations perceived internally or externally.  This creates the scale from impatience to the total intolerance of anything or anyone that fetters the interests of the Soul via the personality.  The intrinsic stressors are reflected in the natural squares to Aries and the 1st house. Because of the archetypal impetus of self-discovery there is a conflict in establishing security through familiarity (Cancer in the 4th).  The only constant is change and to SN Aries/1st that change is always subjective and imperative. However, this can create present-life restriction during childhood, within the family, where individual self-expression may be stifled or resources are fixed and cannot accommodate all wants and wishes.  The square to Capricorn and the 10th is triggered by external conditioning through culture and society, the model and structures of the family, or other collective group in a position of power and authority leveraging from the expectations of the consensus.
At the most vibrationally dense level, the South Node in Aries can clench so tightly to the agenda of survival that the external world becomes ‘black and white,’ and the gut (with the adrenals and solar plexus chakra) clamor on a moment-to-moment basis making decisions on a binary level: free - not free, safe - not safe.  With such a focus on self-preservation, environmental and other external factors (including people) simply enable or disable the individual’s latitude.  This can develop into narcissism, paranoia, and/ or psychopathy where others (by the projection of distorted perceptions) are depersonalized i.e. divested of human characteristics.  When another stands in opposition, in reality or again cast in opposition, anger and rage can spurn competition and incite violence.  The act of violence is especially devastating to the Soul due to the degree of identification the SN Aries has with their position and how onboard, so to speak, their body can become (Mars ruling the primary brain, adrenals, muscles, blood). This can be the fuel for super-human strength that can escalate into sexual violence, fighting, or war and through muscle memory the body can become essentially addicted to its own adrenaline, its own psychosomatic experience of involution.
A more common experience would be a sense of specialness, or exposed identity.  This could have also been imposed initially (e.g. ‘the chosen one’) but eventually, an  identification with initiating an exceptional endeavor, or special destiny emerges.  While everything might feel ‘Right’, important, and congruent with the conscious desires, living as a vector ultimately stagnates as the separating desires of the SN Aries/ 1st are exhausted.  Identity in isolation becomes a self-containing role, becoming its own block. The Soul recognizes that the frontier is now relating to others via the polarity point: North Node in Libra and the 7th house.  The real beauty here is that it is still true to the deepest desires of the Soul to create new experiences that break through existing limitations!

NN in Libra/ 7th

Shifting the emphasis to the NN not only becomes a task of learning to be receptive to input and feedback, but really recognizing of the inherent equality of all Souls.  It requires an acknowledgement of the relativity and validity of each person’s desires and needs.  The resistance to meeting others halfway is a reverberation of the past from fears of having to cater (Cancer/4th) and kowtow (Capricorn/10th). Understanding that the fear of loosing one’s individuality and autonomy in acquiescence or commitment (inconjunct to Scorpio/8th) is a fear and not an inevitability, can only come through first-hand experience. Working through the fear in a way that is constructive and healthy means taking the courage to engage in direct confrontation into situations where mediation and diplomacy are needed, where fairness and balance are required for the betterment of all.  It means applying all the focus and ambition and challenging oneself to be open: to being seen, to listening to partners, and shifting into a more objective awareness. It means forfeiting the need to control and learning flexibility within relationship. This works towards an ego that feels more secure within itself. And ultimately, it is those who have clear ego-strength that do not seek co-dependence or emotional validation and can hold themselves as equals.

Progressive opening of the heart chakra...

Consensus State- SN in Aries/1st uses it's energy on the level of survival: steering clear of those who would create dependencies, acquiring money and resources, competing for the positions of the most power and freedom, sex as the focus of relationships. NN in Libra/7th (would take the edge off, but not by much.) Granting a moment of hearing the other side, perhaps tithing, or donation of time to a church or civil cause.

Individuated State-  SN in Aries/1st might put up a fight and/ or withdraw in childhood/ early family life. Possibly run away. Spend a concerted about of time tinkering and learning the skills required to actualize an independent adult life. NN in Libra/7th could attract like-minded thinking/feeling individuals who contribute their own expertise into the 'salon'. Fight for social justice and equality.

Spiritual State: Sn in Aries/1st could be an intense focus on a practice of their own design i.e. without affiliation. Hermit in the sense of seclusion. Healer who works spontaneously. NN in Libra/7th could focus on making themselves available to all kinds of people and speaking in a way that is accessible and useful to all, emphasizing compassion and simple acts of kindness.  (Dalai Lama XIV, NN in Capricorn in the 7th)

Thanks Ari!
God Bless,
Katherine
« Last Edit: Apr 20, 2014, 03:51 AM by Katherine » Logged
Emily
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« Reply #98 on: Apr 19, 2014, 12:50 PM »

Thank you for your responses to my post Ari Moshe - And thank you everyone for the learning experience.

Namaste,
Emily
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ari moshe
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« Reply #99 on: Apr 21, 2014, 03:13 PM »

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Hi Katherine,

SN in Aries/ the 1st

The Soul has begun a new cycle of evolutionary growth by desiring an ego structure that will accelerate evolution on a conscious and subjective level.  The subjective awareness, the “I”, is the identity—it is completely self-referential and unqualified.  On instinct, the personality will (by whatever means necessary) initiate experiences that assert their independence and sovereignty.  These expressions of willpower are the manifestations of the core desire nature: to be free.  To be free from any existing limitations perceived internally or externally.  This creates the scale from impatience to the total intolerance of anything or anyone that fetters the interests of the Soul via the personality.  The intrinsic stressors are reflected in the natural squares to Aries and the 1st house. Because of the archetypal impetus of self-discovery there is a conflict in establishing security through familiarity (Cancer in the 4th).  The only constant is change and to SN Aries/1st that change is always subjective and imperative. However, this can create present-life restriction during childhood, within the family, where individual self-expression may be stifled or resources are fixed and cannot accommodate all wants and wishes.  The square to Capricorn and the 10th is triggered by external conditioning through culture and society, the model and structures of the family, or other collective group in a position of power and authority leveraging from the expectations of the consensus.

At the most vibrationally dense level, the South Node in Aries can clench so tightly to the agenda of survival that the external world becomes ‘black and white,’ and the gut (with the adrenals and solar plexus chakra) clamor on a moment-to-moment basis making decisions on a binary level: free - not free, safe - not safe.

So well said.

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With such a focus on self-preservation, environmental and other external factors (including people) simply enable or disable the individual’s latitude.  This can develop into narcissism, paranoia, and/ or psychopathy where others (by the projection of distorted perceptions) are depersonalized i.e. divested of human characteristics.


Paranoia is not specific to Aries just by itself. Paranoia as well as the depersonalization/objectification of other humans would be Aquarius/Uranus/11th house.

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When another stands in opposition, in reality or again cast in opposition, anger and rage can spurn competition and incite violence.  The act of violence is especially devastating to the Soul due to the degree of identification the SN Aries has with their position and how onboard, so to speak, their body can become (Mars ruling the primary brain, adrenals, muscles, blood). This can be the fuel for super-human strength that can escalate into sexual violence, fighting, or war and through muscle memory the body can become essentially addicted to its own adrenaline, its own psychosomatic experience of involution.

What do you mean by "psychosomatic experience of involution"? I don't understand the intent of the use of involution in this context.

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A more common experience would be a sense of specialness, or exposed identity.  This could have also been imposed initially (e.g. ‘the chosen one’) but eventually, an  identification with initiating an exceptional endeavor, or special destiny emerges.  While everything might feel ‘Right’, important, and congruent with the conscious desires, living as a vector ultimately stagnates as the separating desires of the SN Aries/ 1st are exhausted.  Identity in isolation becomes a self-containing role, becoming its own block. The Soul recognizes that the frontier is now relating to others via the polarity point: North Node in Libra and the 7th house.  The real beauty here is that it is still true to the deepest desires of the Soul to create new experiences that break through existing limitations!

Wow great insight!

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NN in Libra/ 7th

Shifting the emphasis to the NN not only becomes a task of learning to be receptive to input and feedback, but really recognizing of the inherent equality of all Souls.  It requires an acknowledgement of the relativity and validity of each person’s desires and needs.  The resistance to meeting others halfway is a reverberation of the past from fears of having to cater (Cancer/4th) and kowtow (Capricorn/10th). Understanding that the fear of loosing one’s individuality and autonomy in acquiescence or commitment (inconjunct to Scorpio/8th) is a fear and not an inevitability, can only come through first-hand experience. Working through the fear in a way that is constructive and healthy means taking the courage to engage in direct confrontation into situations where mediation and diplomacy are needed, where fairness and balance are required for the betterment of all.  It means applying all the focus and ambition and challenging oneself to be open: to being seen, to listening to partners, and shifting into a more objective awareness. It means forfeiting the need to control and learning flexibility within relationship. This works towards an ego that feels more secure within itself. And ultimately, it is those who have clear ego-strength that do not seek co-dependence or emotional validation and can hold themselves as equals.

Beautifully said, and that is how the nn heals any sn karma: there is no longer a need to react or defend.

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Progressive opening of the heart chakra...

Consensus State- SN in Aries/1st uses it's energy on the level of survival: steering clear of those who would create dependencies, acquiring money and resources, competing for the positions of the most power and freedom, sex as the focus of relationships. NN in Libra/7th (would take the edge off, but not by much.) Granting a moment of hearing the other side, perhaps tithing, or donation of time to a church or civil cause.


It can also imply learning listen to other people's advice. For example a soul in 1st consensus will learn how to listen to others instead of just doing whatever they want to do. As the soul moves through 2nd consensus they will learn more about cooperation and listening skills for otherwise they will never get ahead in the world. In third consensus it might be learning to be fair to other people. Instead of controlling and always being the leader, to also allow other people to lead - to listen and appreciate other people's points of views.

Also, and this is true for any evolutionary stage, the soul may find themselves in a relationship of some sort where the needs of their partner requires that they listen more and learn how to give according to what is needed. There might be a history of violence, in which case the soul will be learning to listen (according to consensus models of how to listen and deal with anger) instead of react.

Donation of time to a church is not inherently linked to Libra.

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Individuated State-  SN in Aries/1st might put up a fight and/ or withdraw in childhood/ early family life. Possibly run away. Spend a concerted about of time tinkering and learning the skills required to actualize an independent adult life. NN in Libra/7th could attract like-minded thinking/feeling individuals who contribute their own expertise into the 'salon'. Fight for social justice and equality.

Also the soul might be learning not to be reactive and defensive. 3rd stage individuated for example would learn that more can be accomplished through true listening; hearing all sides. Egalitarian values will be developed. The soul may also be drawn towards models like non violent communication and such.

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Spiritual State: Sn in Aries/1st could be an intense focus on a practice of their own design i.e. without affiliation. Hermit in the sense of seclusion. Healer who works spontaneously. NN in Libra/7th could focus on making themselves available to all kinds of people and speaking in a way that is accessible and useful to all, emphasizing compassion and simple acts of kindness.  (Dalai Lama XIV, NN in Capricorn in the 7th)

And also creating/cultivating equal relationships. If this is a teacher, then the intent might be to cultivate an image of themselves as equal to others instead of always being the "leader". The soul also may realize their own needs for a more personally fulfilling, balanced expression of relationship as well.

Thank you for your post Katherine! Your explanation of the sn and nn expresses a clear understanding of what they represent and the various ways in which they can express.
With love,
Ari Moshe
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Katherine
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« Reply #100 on: Apr 23, 2014, 03:37 AM »

Hi Ari,
Thanks so much for your feedback.

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Paranoia is not specific to Aries just by itself. Paranoia as well as the depersonalization/objectification of other humans would be Aquarius/Uranus/11th house.

I am familiar with this correlation to Aquarius and I wasn't sure what word would best suit the feeling I was trying to describe and didn't want to just say intense fear because I felt that was too generic--it suggests so many types of experiences. I was double-dutching it because I wanted a word with the patina of isolation and gut awareness. In retrospect, paranoia is more heady and sketched out. Anxiety, panic, or alarm would have been more appropriate.

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What do you mean by "psychosomatic experience of involution"? I don't understand the intent of the use of involution in this context.

I will check my understanding of involution. Then get back to you on this.

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Wow great insight!

Not sure which part you were referring to but, I really wanted to get a sense of this signature. Drop in and feel the dynamic. And when I saw (at least to my capacity as a beginner) the SN-NN shift from Aries to Libra and the everything changed / nothing really changed  I was floored. It's a saturation threshold! When we em-body the lessons of the SN they become the tools and gifts that enable the NN to be actualized. (It's an exact opposition.)

And thank you for the examples within each evolutionary state, for taking the time. That was really helpful.

Much love, Ari.
God Bless,
Katherine
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ari moshe
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« Reply #101 on: Apr 23, 2014, 10:34 AM »

Hi Katherine, the line that was a great insight for me was:

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The Soul recognizes that the frontier is now relating to others via the polarity point: North Node in Libra and the 7th house.  The real beauty here is that it is still true to the deepest desires of the Soul to create new experiences that break through existing limitations!

By embracing the polarity NOTHING true or necessary is actually lost, rather it only enhances the soul's capacity for growth in all areas of its life. Only from the point of view of resistance does the polarity seem to be threatening. We can apply that line of thinking to every sn/nn polarity.
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ari moshe
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« Reply #102 on: Apr 23, 2014, 10:37 AM »

Hi everyone!
Next week we will begin with applying the EA paradigm: Pluto, Pluto polarity point and the lunar nodes.
For those who still intend to post on the lunar nodes practice - feel free to post whenever even if its after we move on to the next step. Just let me know if you still intend to post.
With love,
Ari Moshe
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Wei
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« Reply #103 on: Apr 25, 2014, 04:29 AM »

Hi Ari, Would you please explain in what case NN is part of past life experiences except planet/planets square nodes? Maybe NN ruler conjunct SN, pluto aspect NN, or NN in scorpio/8th house?
Thanks!
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ari moshe
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« Reply #104 on: Apr 27, 2014, 12:51 PM »

Hi Wei,

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Would you please explain in what case NN is part of past life experiences except planet/planets square nodes? Maybe NN ruler conjunct SN, pluto aspect NN, or NN in scorpio/8th house?

The nn has been developed/experienced prior to this life whenever any planet forms any aspect to it.
Beyond that, I'm not sure what else. With the nn ruler conjunct the sn, past dynamics need to be re-lived and done in a way that promotes evolution this time around.

Rad or anyone else, are there any other configurations in which the nn has been developed prior to the current life?

With love,
Ari Moshe
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