Questions about Second Stage Spiritual

Wendy · Mar 30, 2010, 12:13 AM

Okay so this poses another question for me. Is a teaching, such as the Course in Miracles, a legitamate pathway to undo the spiritualized ego leading to the 3rd stage spiritual?

I learned about the spiritualized ego several years ago which the Course in Miracles talks about.

Would those like David Hawkins, a huge advocate of the Course and a recovering alcoholic be considered 3rd stage spiritual or is he also in 2nd stage. He really debunks the spiritualized ego which uses what he calls hocus pocus (tarot cards, astrology, ...) stating also that the Course in Miracles can be misleading for those naive to other influences of evil.

David R. Hawkins, M.D. (born June 3, 1927) is an American psychiatrist, mystic, author and spiritual teacher in Sedona, Arizona.

Hawkins grew up in Wisconsin. He served in WWII, where he was assigned to hazardous duty on a minesweeper.[1] Hawkins received a B.S. in pre-med from Marquette University (1950)[2], an M.D. from the Medical College of Wisconsin (1953), and a Ph.D. from Columbia Pacific University (1995).[3]

Hawkins teaches that applied kinesiology can distinguish truth or falsity in any statement while applying his "Map of Consciousness" that divides the general areas of force and power.[3]

http://www.astro.com/cgi/showgif.cgi?lang=e&gif=astro_gw__david_hawkins.15508.16689.gif&res=100&va=&cid=dbdfile9vKq7I-u1218739744

PamS · Mar 30, 2010, 11:01 AM

Hi Wendy,

I dont have an answer for you on these people.. I have never been drawn to A Course in Miracles, I also dont know who David Hawkins is. So sorry, ...

Pam

Wendy · Mar 30, 2010, 11:18 AM

Thanks Pam. Both these folks are in second stage spiritual states, and I am interested in learning more about these stages of evolution. So maybe someone else may known.

Thank you.

Rad · Mar 30, 2010, 11:53 AM

HI Pam,

Quote from: PamS on Mar 29, 2010, 05:30 PM
Hi All,

Rad, I really want to get this.... So 11th house-Aquarius-Uranus is channelling generally,, but only with the added 12th house- Pisces-Neptune with it? So sorry, I need that clarified...

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True channeling requires that the egocentric, Moon, structure within the the consciousness of the Soul becomes dissolved while the channeling is taking place. Dissolving the egocentric structure is a Pisces, Neptune, 12th House archetype. So, yes, true channeling is a combination of Aquarius, 11th House, and Uranus with Neptune, 12th House, and Pisces. But, even here, the capacity and potential for self delusion, and thus deluding others, is in place. As in the case of Claire Prophet given that her S.Node is in the 11th in Taurus, and ruled by her Venus in Pisces in the 9th. True channeling, again, is a very rare phenomena. And it is rare for a specific reason: what is the need, intent, and reason for any Soul to be used for such channeling in the first place ?

The nature of Claire Prophets Soul delusions go all the way back to the time of Jesus Christ. There were any others in that time that were considered the 'messiah'. She considered herself in a life at that time in exactly that way. And, as you pointed out with all the 10th House stuff, her Pluto in the 1st squaring the Saturn in Aries in the 10th, her Soul has desired great power, and to be considered as a 'spiritual leader'. It is the root desire since that time that has culminated in the life in which she just lived.

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In Prophets chart, We see the NN in Taurus in the 11th house would that be a symbol of her channeling her individuated unconscious? Combined with the Pisces in the 9th?

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Yes, although it's the S.Node is in Taurus in the 11th ...... ruled by that Venus in the 9th in Pisces. This correlates within her to 'receiving visions of a cataclysmic nature' about the future, and forming communities in order to survive them. When this is then combined with her desire to be a 'spiritual leader' , in authority, this then becomes the cause of her delusions in order to have that position of authority and leadership.

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Im real skeptial of all those 10th houseplanets as well as the new phase Sun Saturn and that 1st house Pluto in her chart...as well as the SN in Scorpio in the 5th... thats alot of authority issues as well as self- centerness.....

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Yes, but again you have the Nodes reversed Pam. With that N.Node in the 5th, and in Scorpio, ruled by her Pluto in the 1st, she finally 'achieved' the degree of 'fame' and notoriety that she has desired.

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Rad

Wendy · Mar 30, 2010, 01:07 PM

Thanks for your questions Pam and Rad's answers.

Since she achieved the power her soul longed for, what would her next evolutionary life path be? 2nd stage spiritual or would she advance?

PamS · Mar 30, 2010, 04:42 PM

Thank you Rad,

doink yes the NN is the Scorpio in the 5th...

my excitement brought on my dyslexisa.. I get it...

True channeling, again, is a very rare phenomena. And it is rare for a specific reason: what is the need, intent, and reason for any Soul to be used for such channeling in the first place ?

Yes I agree with you as what kind of soul wants the authority to channel for others? In Prophets chart, the desire for authority is strong....very interesting....

Thank you Rad!

peace be with you!!

blessings,

pam

PamS · Mar 30, 2010, 04:44 PM

Hi Wendy,

Ok change of information... Marianne Williamson uses A Course on Miracles... I dont know who wrote that... Wendy do you know this?

Is Marianne Willliamson spiritual 2? I dont know... I find her spirit light, but that is a personal observation? My guess is that she is spirit 1- cause she has some deep insight...

anyone have an opinion on that?

blessings,

pam

Rad · Mar 30, 2010, 04:51 PM

Hi Wendy,

It's impossible to know for sure. She has been in this stage for many lifetimes. And, of course, it's impossible to know how she inwardly dealt with the fact that her various predictions never came true, and the obvious humiliation this created. She did keep changing the dates of her predictions when they did not materialize. So that does give us some indication that she was not 'learning' what she needed to learn. It's also impossible to know how she inwardly understood and dealt with her deteriorating condition. These issues are the determinant of what comes next.

Rad

Wendy · Mar 31, 2010, 04:55 AM

Thank you Rad for your responses. I am quite curious about these things. Did you see my earlier post about David Hawkins.

ari moshe · Mar 31, 2010, 06:57 AM

Wow, there is so much goodness going on at once here. Is it just me- or is anyone else feeling super mentally stimulated?

I intend to spend more time with the prior posts. For now, I just wanted to provide some more info regarding a course in miracles.

Marianne Williamson is a teacher of the course. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marianne_Williamson

(unknown birth time). I don't know much about her actions and decisions to contribute to her evolutionary state. She is a remarkable teacher and has served millions of people through her devotion to A course in miracles. I do wonder if that Jupiter in Taurus squaring the Leo Aquarius nodes, with Pluto on the sn in Leo has any implication of profit hungry self-aggrandizement? It's really hard to tell based on her website alone- she's clearly serving the masses and has an M.O that is suitable from a consensus point of view. Is writing a zillion books about the same thing a second stage spiritual ordeal? I have noticed in general that that true spiritual teachers tend to save their words as much as possible. Is she identified with her power, or is it the clothing she is wearing in order to serve this purpose for others? My hunch is she is in the early to mid second stage spiritual.

ari moshe · Mar 31, 2010, 07:17 AM

About a course in miracles:

The one who scribed it was a Jewish atheist named Hellen Schucman.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Schucman

Jesus is the actual author of the course.

Hellen's ea state seems irrelevant as she was literally just a scribe. It would be interested however to look at her chart:

Gemini nn, with Jupiter as a skipped step. She scribed a course that was dictated to her over many years. She had such internal resistance to doing that work because of a perpetual guilt and anger linked to feeling abandoned by God (Virgo). I've read that a big part of her journey and struggle with the course was simply accepting that it was ok for her to be doing the holy work of scribing it.

I do wonder what her ea state was. She was a humble soul and never wanted any power or fame connected to the course. This reflects itself in the fact that most people who have heard of the course have no clue who she is (on the other hand, many folks think that Marianne Williamson wrote the course- maybe that's an exchange for everyone misplacing ownership of her famous 'we are afraid of our own power' quote to Nelson Mandela... if you know what I'm talking about...)

ari moshe · Mar 31, 2010, 07:47 AM

birth time unknown.
(Hmm. So far all 3 charts posted have Jupiter squaring the nodes)

If this is appropriate/if any ea moderators have knowledge of Hawkins- I'd like to add that I'm really interested in knowing if his chart of the levels of consciousness have any correlation with the evolutionary stages. Also if so, in what way does it correlate. My hunch is that 500= first stage spiritual.
http://celestinechua.com/blog/images/20090208-map-of-consciousness.gif

He also teaches that through kinesthesiology anyone (whose consciousness callibrates above a certain level) is capable of discerning the "level of consciousness" of any book, teacher, or idea etc. I've never seen him misapply that- but it comes off as odd to me, to be utilizing body testing for something that can only be discerned from within. It makes me wonder about the Jupiter in Pisces.

Here's an example of how he works with kenesthesiology to find the Truth. We can see that he isn't teaching anything untrue- in fact what he says feels really right on. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbxaAAJRjgA

This could be a tool his soul wishes to utilize in teaching the truth. Gemini rules the hands/arms does it not?

PamS · Mar 31, 2010, 10:59 AM

Hi Ari,

Thank you so much for all this!

I dont know about the EA stage of Williamson, I kinda think its spirit 1...

Thank you for posting the Course in Miracles info.... lots to look at..

Thank you!!

pam

Wendy · Mar 31, 2010, 11:22 AM

Quote from: ari moshe on Mar 31, 2010, 07:47 AM

(Hmm. So far all 3 charts posted have Jupiter squaring the nodes)

Also nodes in Gemini/Sag for Helen and Hawkins

My hunch is that 500= first stage spiritual.

I agree

He also teaches that through kinesthesiology anyone (whose consciousness callibrates above a certain level) is capable of discerning the "level of consciousness" of any book, teacher, or idea etc. I've never seen him misapply that- but it comes off as odd to me, to be utilizing body testing for something that can only be discerned from within. It makes me wonder about the Jupiter in Pisces.

This could be a tool his soul wishes to utilize in teaching the truth. Gemini rules the hands/arms does it not?

Hawkins wanted to create a scientific study of kinesiology, I guess so to prove it's effectiveness to the consensus world.

Hawkins had a renowned psychiatry practice in NY and began having mystical experiences and could not function. He stopped his practice to dedicate his life to the unfolding within and to the study of kinesiology. Also a recovering alcoholic, many of his teachings speak to addiction and the consciousness it operates from. I know some folks who have studied extensively with him. They told me he and Bill Wilson, founder of Alcoholics Anonymous levitated together and that when my friends go to his satsungs, just from being in his presence their energy fields go into higher and higher states of orientation, taking days to integrate.

One astrologer told me he if felt Hawkins' study was operating from the reptilian brain and was therefore not the whole truth.

PamS · Mar 31, 2010, 12:02 PM

Hi All,

Wendy thank you for the information.... He sounds like a deep guy... but I want to know what operating from the reptallin brain means? I know what it means to me, but im interested how it was meant in this man David? Does it mean operating only out of survival? do you have any other infor on that....

Hi Ari,

Yes interesting 3 Jupiter square the Nodes, that is lots of information.. I know when Jupiter is square the Nodes honesty is a big issue...I also wonder if it would be the skipped step of expanding the information?

Pam