Divination to determine birth time

[Yasmine]

Hello again,

I had one more question I forgot to post earlier.
Here in Ontario birth certificates and records do not contain the actual time of birth, and I've found few people who know their exact birth time. I read in another post the list of EA questions to help determine where Pluto is in a birth chart. Also I am aware of the rectification methods used by some. Just wondering if any astrologers here use a pendelum, cards, muscle testing or any other divination methods in addition, when trying to determine a birth time. If so what combination of methods work best for them. Hope this is an exceptable question. If not, my appologizes and please disregard.
Yasmine

[Skywalker]

Hi Yasmine,

From my experience there are Astrologers that use various tools to determine the birth time and also to aid them in their chart interpretations.

Personally I find that to rectify a chart with no knowledge of the birth time takes alot of Astrological experience and observation of the person and their lives.

If there is some knowledge of the birth time and it´s say an hour or two off then it becomes easier.

What I like to do is get the person to ask their parents or other family member that could know of an approximate time. Generally asking a few people in the family can help give an approximate time as someone will remember a detail or another like if it was at night, before lunch time etc etc.

Sometimes you can look at someone and get a feel right away for their Sun sign or Ascendent so go with your intuition too. If you meet the person and feel right away a strong Sagittarius vibe coming from that person and they have another Sun sign then it could be an indication that you are picking up their Sag Ascendent.
But it´s also a bit more complicated than that as the person could have a planet aspecting the Ascendent therefore coloring it´s expression. Someone with Mercury conjunct the Ascendent could seem like a Gemini Ascendent but could have another rising sign. So again observation is key and trust your intuition while looking at all the other factors in the chart.

Remember even without the houses in the correct positions, there are still the planets in the signs and their aspects which can still be helpful to the person in front of you. So don´t give up if someone comes to you and you can´t determine the Houses. You can also determine by transits and progression what the person is going thru and that can also help to determine their actual planetary placements in the natal chart.

[Upasika]

Hi Yasmine,

I also find what Skywalker has said to be a good way to approach the situation.

However sometimes no-one in the family knows even an approximate period of the day (morning/afternoon/night) the person was born. So I use those transits, progressions etc he is talking about via a software program from Esoteric Technologies called Jigsaw. If a person has reached their first Saturn Return or beyond then they will have had time to accumulate many significant life events. If they compile a list of these events they can be put into Jigsaw and it uses these dates and times to find the probable birth time based on transits, progresions and arcs aligning with the person's main life event dates/times. Then using that birthtime you can look at the chart and see how well it matches the actual person. Jigsaw also has tools to help finetune the original time(s) it came up with. But it does depend on a good list of life events the better the list the better the results Jigsaw can provide.

So I also get people to see a kinesiologist who muscle tests them for their birthtime. I "tested" her first with my time (without telling her what it was), and she was very accurate. And I feel she usually comes up with times for people that are useful. If the birth time she gives me for a person is very close to the time Jigsaw gives me for the person (which is often), then I use that time with a lot of confidence.

However out of interest I've tried different kinesiologists with this, and found some are much more suitable than others, in that they seem to come up with better times, times that either make a lot of sense when I look at the person and/or correspond to a Jigsaw time I have gotten for the person. So not all are equal in this regard, I'm fortunate to have found a kinesiologist who seems to be able to use muscle testing very skillfully for this purpose.

Then, as Skywalker has said, if you know the person well, you can take planets on the cusps of signs etc (moon is a good example here as it moves quite fast) and play with the either/or possibilities of what sign it is in by observation, correlation and talking with the person. Intuition is very useful here. Then finally any new birth time I find for a person can be further confirmed by watching for current transits to sensitive points in the chart - eg ASC, Moon etc.

As you mentioned the Pluto questions can be used too. Sometimes these are useful, sometimes not - depends on how much a person is in tune with their Soul energies, but also how their chart is constructed ... can often have complicated aspects etc invloving Pluto that mask it's true position for either the person themselves, or me asking them questions. But it's an important tool in the toolbox.

If I cannot decide what ASC a person has, I get them to read Martin Schulman's detailed book on Ascendants and say what they feel is the best fit for them, and this gives me additional clues.

The whole process can be a lot of work (not always though) but there seems no other way. And once a person has a good "working" birthtime it makes the houses available which is invaluable, especially in EA.

blessings Upasika

[Yasmine]

Thank you both for the information,

In any case, it seems like quite a process to find an accurate time, but definitely worth the effort. I admit that chart rectification overwhelms me, (still have so much to learn), but I will definitely practice using some of the other suggestions. Obviously the more I can learn about a person the easier this will be.
For years I've used a pendulm for health related and personal questions. I'm very comfortable with it and find it be quite useful and accurate, but feel I would need to use another system or systems in addition for best results. 

Blessings